Valiant Binding

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Jrosen
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Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

As I mentioned in my other post about the reading order. I've just completed binding my first 5 VEI volumes. This is a complete set of VEI books through Armor Hunters, with the exception of X-O Manowar 1-14. I got into the whole VEI universe by reading first XO deluxe hardcover, and I didn't want to rebuy those issues in floppies.

While I know that many of you will probably cry, or at least tear up, when they see books that are cut up and bound, I'm pretty proud of the way this turned out. Even my kids thought I was crazy when they saw me cutting apart the books and destroying the back covers. To be honest, I was actually quite angry with myself when I saw that the Punk Mambo 0, which I bought for $3 in November 2017, was listed for more than $100 in February on eBay.

I was hoping to bring the first volume to C2E2 in a month and get it signed by Dinesh, but, for obvious reasons, I doubt I'll see him there. Warren is supposed to be speaking at a couple panels, and I may try to get him to sign it.

In any case, here are some pictures for you to enjoy!

(mods, please move this thread if this belongs in a different forum category)

Image
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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Juki »

That is some incredible work you put into binding those together. Congrats on a job well done. Impressive! :high-five:

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by jmatt »

Wow, how cool is THAT?! Very nice! :thumb:

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by mkb28 »

Sweet! Well done, my friend! :clap:

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by TheFerg714 »

This is the coolest f***ing thing I've ever seen. Great job!

Way to offset my imminent depression from the Hunter Gorinson thread.
Last edited by TheFerg714 on Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:04:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by TheFerg714 »

I have a few questions, if you don't mind...

1. What was your reasoning behind splitting it up like this?
2. Why put all of Shadowman in one book, rather than split it up like the rest of the series?
3. Why insert X-O's fourth arc inbetween Bloodshot 17 and 19. I think I would have put it in vol. 4, right before Unity. And why move #24 up?
4. What exactly is included in Armor Hunters, and in what order?
5. Why does it say Harbinger: Omegas 1-4?
6. Will Eternal Warrior 5-8 go in a 4001 bind?
7. Missing issues that I'm curious about: A&A 24, HARD Corps 0, X-O 0, and Unity 0?
8. Will there be more? and if so, what will be included?

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Phoenix8008 »

Very nice! Where did you get these done at? I like the full picture covers. My only question is: Where is X-O #1-14?
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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

TheFerg714 wrote:I have a few questions, if you don't mind...

1. What was your reasoning behind splitting it up like this?
2. Why put all of Shadowman in one book, rather than split it up like the rest of the series?
3. Why insert X-O's fourth arc inbetween Bloodshot 17 and 19. I think I would have put it in vol. 4, right before Unity. And why move #24 up?
4. What exactly is included in Armor Hunters, and in what order?
5. Why does it say Harbinger: Omegas 1-4?
6. Will Eternal Warrior 5-8 go in a 4001 bind?
7. Missing issues that I'm curious about: A&A 24, HARD Corps 0, X-O 0, and Unity 0?
8. Will there be more? and if so, what will be included?
1. I followed, for the most part the reading order from: https://sothatyoumayfollow.wordpress.co ... ing-order/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; but I also had some limitations. The binding gets cumbersome if too many books are included. So I tried to limit the number of floppies in each book to a maximum of 40. I also didn't want to split up arcs that tied together. So, for example, although that reading order had Shadowman before Harbinger Wars, it made more sense to push that arc to book 2 and keep, what I'll call the prelude to Harbinger Wars together with Harbinger Wars.

2. This was mostly following the reading order that I was going. There is a definite "break" in the storyarc between 10 and 11, which made for a good stopping point.

3. Bloodshot story arc had a stopping point after 15, and the reading order slotted in the XO story. I stayed with it. Bloodshot 24 was a one-shot that really had no good placement. I stayed with the provided reading order for that.

4. XO 26, 27, 28, 23, 24, parts of 25; Armor Hunters (AH) 1; Unity 8; AH 2, Unity 9, Harbinger 1, BS 1, BS 2, BS 3, AH 3, Unity 10, Harbinger 2, Harbinger 3, Unity 11, AH 4, XO 29, AH Aftermath

I added all of the Valiant Compass Points from Harbinger 1 through Aftermath to the end of Armor Hunters book.

5. You didn't get the special release premium format Omegas 4? Neither did I, it was a typo.

6. I have Eternal Warrior 5-8 slotted for right after Rai 1-4 in book 6. The 4001 stuff is tricky because it really doesn't relate to the rest of the universe, but I don't want to "forget" about those stories.

7. A&A 24 was a one-shot that interupted the last A&A arc. It gets slotted with parts of 25 and the 1% oneshot in my book 6. Hard Corps 0 was included after Bloodshot 19. The other Bloodshot 0 was slotted in between 17 and 24, but another typo left it off. I have XO 0 slotted for right before XO 30, in book 6. Unity 0 and Faith 0 go with Unity 12, 13, and 14, also in book 6.

Book 6 looks like:

Shadowman Endtimes      1
Shadowman Endtimes      2
Shadowman Endtimes      3
The Death-Defying Doctor Mirage      1
The Death-Defying Doctor Mirage      2
The Death-Defying Doctor Mirage      3
The Death-Defying Doctor Mirage      4
The Death-Defying Doctor Mirage      5
Rai      1
Rai      2
Rai      3
Rai      4
Eternal Warrior      5
Eternal Warrior      6
Eternal Warrior      7
Eternal Warrior      8
Archer & Armstrong      24
Archer & Armstrong      25      (segment: IMMORTAL COMBAT)
Archer & Armstrong      25      (segment: HAPPY RETURNS)
Archer & Armstrong      25      (segment: 1% — NEW BREED)
One Percent      1
The Delinquents      1
The Delinquents      2
The Delinquents      3
The Delinquents      4
X-O Manowar      25      (segment: BATTLE FOR THE AGES)
X-O Manowar      0
X-O Manowar      30
X-O Manowar      31
X-O Manowar      32
X-O Manowar      33
Unity      0
Unity      12
Faith      0
Unity      13
Unity      14


8. I've sorted out 10 books, through Wrath of the Eternal Warrior. I don't want to go too quickly because Valiant always seems to release books that may better belong with earlier stories. For example, Eternal Warrior Awaken should have been added to Book 1 with the first Eternal Warrior miniseries, but the book was already at the binder when I got around to reading that one-shot. My guess is that I'll send the next 5 books to the binder sometime around December.

I've been looking for feedback on the reading order that I put together where the one at the top of the page stops in in another thread: http://www.valiantfans.com/forum/viewto ... =1&t=51198" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So far, nobody has commented. Buehler? Buehler?

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

Phoenix8008 wrote:Very nice! Where did you get these done at? I like the full picture covers. My only question is: Where is X-O #1-14?
I've been using Houchen Bindery: http://www.houchenbindery.com/services/comic-books/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; They are based in Nebraska.

I know they say the limit is 25 books, but really its more about the size of the bind. VEI stuff tends to be thinner than Marvel and DC as they have a lot less ads. I also get rid of all of the preview pages that VEI adds to the end of the story and the back cover, which greatly reduces the page count per floppy. I had previously bound Marvel's entire Darth Vader run with the full crossover "Vader Down" into one book, which had a bigger page count than my VEI book 1 bind.

If you go the binding route, make sure you know someone that can use Photoshop. The template that they provide for creating a cover is very complex for a novice photo editor, and it really takes some skill to set it up properly so that the cover image is the right size. Also, since the binding changes size based on the number of books you include, you can't use the same "template" for every book. It needs to be created from scratch every time.

I got into VEI when my LCS recommended Generation Zero and Harbinger Renegades. I really liked XO (2017) when it was released, but I felt like I was missing something without knowing his origin. So, I went out and bought the first deluxe hard cover, which included XO 1-14, and I didn't want to pay for the floppies and the binding when I already had a nice, easy to read, and on the shelf set of these books.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by jmatt »

Second chime in: I love those covers!

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by ShadowTuga »

While what you did is something I could never ever ever never ever do to any of my comics, I join the chorus: GREAT looking covers, sir. Looks beautiful, specially that Unity volume (4).
If I may suggest something to give it an even more pro look: dustcovers. Maybe with a spine design. That way they could look even more awesome in the shelf. Not that they don't, I LOVE the info given on the outside of the books- saves some time, absolutely.

Great Work, this gotta be the coolest way to just read Valiant, all in big books, chronologically and all that. Very tempting to pick a random volume and just read a ton of comics. :thumb:
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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

Thanks for all of the feedback on the covers. I may be biased, but I completely agree that they came out perfect. I could have done a cloth binding with a dust cover, but that would have added $13 per book, which was too expensive.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by mkb28 »

I am a big fan of Houchen Bindery as well. :thumb: I used to travel near them for work and I could always drop off my books to save on shipping.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Daniel Jackson »

Nicely done.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

I've steadily made progress on binding VEI. I'm now up to book 8, which takes me through Divinity 2.

As side projects, I've also bound Pre-Unity/Unity and all of the stories involving Priest's version of Quantum and Woody.

I know many of you will cringe at the thought of slashing some of these VH1 books or the Legends of the Geomancer, but I don't care. :D

ImageValiant Spines by Jeff Rosen, on Flickr

ImagePre-Unity Covers by Jeff Rosen, on Flickr

ImagePre-Unity Backs by Jeff Rosen, on Flickr
Last edited by Jrosen on Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:11:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Not_Bloodshot »

OK.

First of all, your children are correct. You are a madman...

Secondly, you are a madman with some of the greatest talents I have ever seen! I have seen other people bind their Valiant books, and the efforts are...interesting, but you, sir, have applied incredible design and thought to yours. I am especially a fan of how you handled the Pre-Unity 1, 2, and Unity bindings. Absolutely amazing.

Image

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Not_Bloodshot wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 12:20:44 pmI am especially a fan of how you handled the Pre-Unity 1, 2, and Unity bindings. Absolutely amazing.
Absolutely amazing indeed....especially the spines. Nicely done, Jrosen! :thumb:

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by possumgrease »

This is amazing. Really well done.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by nycjadie »

This is awesome. We all have a thing once we collect the series and are still rabid fans. Me, I collect all the books in 9.8 condition. You, you make a superb one-of-a-kind binding. Well done!

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

Not_Bloodshot wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 12:20:44 pm OK.

First of all, your children are correct. You are a madman...

Secondly, you are a madman with some of the greatest talents I have ever seen! I have seen other people bind their Valiant books, and the efforts are...interesting, but you, sir, have applied incredible design and thought to yours. I am especially a fan of how you handled the Pre-Unity 1, 2, and Unity bindings. Absolutely amazing.

Image
Half the fun in binding is trying to develop the right covers and spines. For me VEI binds, I kept the spines generic so that I can pull the books out easily when I'm looking for a particular story arc. With VH1, the continuity was so tight that I really felt that they needed to be read altogether. So I opted for the image instead of titles. I do have a title page that I can send images of that show the read order for books 1 and 2.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

nycjadie wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:01:06 pm This is awesome. We all have a thing once we collect the series and are still rabid fans. Me, I collect all the books in 9.8 condition. You, you make a superb one-of-a-kind binding. Well done!
I've submitted 2 books to CGC in my life. One was an Aftershock title (Animosity 1 - Blindbox Variant) that I wanted to test to see how I liked it. It came back, unpressed, at 9.6 and I probably should have pressed it.

The other was a submission for the Todd McFarlane signature series (Hulk 340) that CGC offered in December. I thought the book I sent to be signed would come at 7.5-8.0, and I was planning on cracking the book out of the case to frame it. It came back as 9.2, and I'm kicking myself for not getting it pressed. Not that I want to sell it, but I've seen 9.6s sell for quite a lot of money. (I bought mine for $55 last year at C2E2 with the intention of getting it signed someday)

Since I plan on binding most of the books I buy, I tend to look for the cheapest way to get them. I've put together a Malev War binding, where I ripped the cover off of a Rai 0. It definitely wasn't a 9.8.

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Not_Bloodshot »

Jrosen wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:22:46 am
nycjadie wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:01:06 pm This is awesome. We all have a thing once we collect the series and are still rabid fans. Me, I collect all the books in 9.8 condition. You, you make a superb one-of-a-kind binding. Well done!
I've submitted 2 books to CGC in my life. One was an Aftershock title (Animosity 1 - Blindbox Variant) that I wanted to test to see how I liked it. It came back, unpressed, at 9.6 and I probably should have pressed it.

The other was a submission for the Todd McFarlane signature series (Hulk 340) that CGC offered in December. I thought the book I sent to be signed would come at 7.5-8.0, and I was planning on cracking the book out of the case to frame it. It came back as 9.2, and I'm kicking myself for not getting it pressed. Not that I want to sell it, but I've seen 9.6s sell for quite a lot of money. (I bought mine for $55 last year at C2E2 with the intention of getting it signed someday)

Since I plan on binding most of the books I buy, I tend to look for the cheapest way to get them. I've put together a Malev War binding, where I ripped the cover off of a Rai 0. It definitely wasn't a 9.8.
I sent off 20 books for the CGC McFarlane pressing including two of the 340's. I received them back. One 340 came back as 9.2, the other was 9.6. I thought both were fair grades when I looked at them, but I paid for pressing on all and there was no indication they were pressed. I did the same with some Spawn 300's and one of the 1:50's was never opened, it was graded at 9.2. (I haven't gotten it back to see why it was graded so low and there are no grading notes.)

I just started sending books to CGC in the last 6 months. Mainly to reholder them to get the Valiant and Marvel Labels. (Still irritates me that they won't do the Valiant label on a Signed book...) After I received my first Iron Man books that weren't pressed, I've sent off about 100 of my favorites like my first appearance and first origin of Black Panther, Rai 0 Glossy, Yellow Costume Daredevil 4 and 6's, an entire great condition set of McFarlane ASM and Spiderman books. I paid for the non express grading because I'm not selling them so I don't care if it takes 6 months to get them back and the price looks like it's about $45 per book for standard grading and pressing with custom labels if you ship them in 25 pack bulk sets. Of you go express with pressing and grading, it's about $100 per book. I did that on my Daredevil 4, 6, and the early Avengers Black Panther Origin book. It still took 3 months to get my Daredevils back. The Black Panther book came back in 2 months. None of them came back graded higher than I would have expected with no pressing or dry cleaning, which they claim they do when you pay for the pressing.

Basically, my point is, based on current results, don't waste your money on CGC/CCS Pressing/Grading Services. I feel confident saying they actually may not be doing anything.

Other people advertise pressing/dry clean services online, which don't count as restoration when graded. IF I ever send another RAW book to CGC again, I won't risk it until I find a better pressing/cleaning company.

Another thought could be this. There is a nice Comic shop that I know. The owner is very nice and respectful of people's collector passions. He is a CGC dealer. I talked to him one day about CGC and he told me about a customer that purchased a book from him that he told him should be a 9.2 if graded. The customer sent it off to CGC and it came back as a 7.0. The customer came back demanding a refund. He asked if they would be ok if he cracked it and resubmitted to see how it came back. The customer agreed. They broke it open and took close up pics before the customer left so the customer would see when it came back that it was the same book. The dealer submitted it to CGC as a CGC dealer.
When the book came back, it was graded 9.6! Same book, no pressing...

I bought a CGC 9.6 SS Secret Wars 8 with a sketch by Mike Zeck for $100 from that dealer. I had it reholdered with a Spiderman label a few months ago. It looks great, like a 9.6, but I have some they sent back to me at 9.0 or 9.2 that have very similar issues or less.

If you have a limited custom Marvel Label from last year, I don't think you can get that label reapplied if/when you resubmit. Aside from that, those may be some tips for you. If you can find a CGC dealer that you trust and won't charge you more than the book is worth, you may do better. Or maybe you just need to be famous like greg to get a CGC 10 Rai 0 and not be a nobody like Not_Bloodshot! :D

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Not_Bloodshot »

Jrosen wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:14:30 am
Not_Bloodshot wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 12:20:44 pm OK.

First of all, your children are correct. You are a madman...

Secondly, you are a madman with some of the greatest talents I have ever seen! I have seen other people bind their Valiant books, and the efforts are...interesting, but you, sir, have applied incredible design and thought to yours. I am especially a fan of how you handled the Pre-Unity 1, 2, and Unity bindings. Absolutely amazing.

Image
Half the fun in binding is trying to develop the right covers and spines. For me VEI binds, I kept the spines generic so that I can pull the books out easily when I'm looking for a particular story arc. With VH1, the continuity was so tight that I really felt that they needed to be read altogether. So I opted for the image instead of titles. I do have a title page that I can send images of that show the read order for books 1 and 2.
I feel like it may be your duty to the community to post that custom title page on this thread!

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by Jrosen »

Here are the title pages. Sorry about the glare. They were printed on photopaper, which made them difficult to take a picture. Unfortunately, the scans are on a different computer, and I couldn't attach them.

Pre-Unity 1

ImagePre-unity 1 by Jeff Rosen, on Flickr

Pre-Unity 2

ImagePre-Unity 2 by Jeff Rosen, on Flickr

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Re: Valiant Binding

Post by The Chosen 1 »

That is some seriously impressive work. I personally wouldn't do it to my collection, but what you've done looks fantastic.
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