The Boon

[jmatt]

Okay, we've seen the intro to this book a few times before, but I wanted to think out loud about a few things.

1. What could and did kill Gilad? We know he died bringing The Boon back from The Faraway.

2. Aram doesn't seem to know how it will work ("we don't know what will happen when we turn it on") but he does seem to know its purpose; that is, he seems to believe that it works on other creatures but not if it will work on a human ("or if it even works on humans!"). However, Aram does seem to know it will kill many people.

3. Ivar, on the other hand seems to know that it will impart eternal life ("must eternal life be for the gods alone?"). There's some ambiguity here, have they seen this device in action or not? Hmmm.

3. Neither Aram nor Ivar seem afraid for themselves, there's no talk of "it could kill us too!". Ivar doesn't seem concerned at all, actually.

4. The device is situated just outside a small hallway. Gilad lies in state at the other end of the small hallway. It would seem that the device sucks in life energy on one side and blasts it out the other pointed at Gilad.

5. Ivar refers to to the three brothers as "The Anni-Padda". I don't think we've ever seen them refer to themselves in this manner before. It resonates as if they are an entity unto themselves, apart from human individuals.

6. And as I've pointed out before, the narrative calls this place Mesopotamia (ancient Iraq, circa 3,000 BC) but the graphic of a single earthly continent is that of Pangea. The two references are separated by about 3 billion years of history. The team has indicated they are hewing closely to historical record, perhaps this was just some unintended artistic license that has no real bearing on the story.

[BugsySig]

Okay, we've seen the intro to this book a few times before, but I wanted to think out loud about a few things.

1. What could and did kill Gilad? We know he died bringing The Boon back from The Faraway.

2. Aram doesn't seem to know how it will work ("we don't know what will happen when we turn it on") but he does seem to know its purpose; that is, he seems to believe that it works on other creatures but not if it will work on a human ("or if it even works on humans!"). However, Aram does seem to know it will kill many people.

3. Ivar, on the other hand seems to know that it will impart eternal life ("must eternal life be for the gods alone?"). There's some ambiguity here, have they seen this device in action or not? Hmmm.

3. Neither Aram nor Ivar seem afraid for themselves, there's no talk of "it could kill us too!". Ivar doesn't seem concerned at all, actually.

4. The device is situated just outside a small hallway. Gilad lies in state at the other end of the small hallway. It would seem that the device sucks in life energy on one side and blasts it out the other pointed at Gilad.

5. Ivar refers to to the three brothers as "The Anni-Padda". I don't think we've ever seen them refer to themselves in this manner before. It resonates as if they are an entity unto themselves, apart from human individuals.

6. And as I've pointed out before, the narrative calls this place Mesopotamia (ancient Iraq, circa 3,000 BC) but the graphic of a single earthly continent is that of Pangea. The two references are separated by about 3 billion years of history. The team has indicated they are hewing closely to historical record, perhaps this was just some unintended artistic license that has no real bearing on the story.

I didn't see it as one large continent. I saw it as the energy from the Boon expanding across the planet. And didn't FVL post about an archeological site that is about 10 thousand years old?

The rest of your points are all well taken...definitely much more to explore here, like with the Bleeding Monk in Harbinger.

[Tim]

3. Ivar, on the other hand seems to know that it will impart eternal life ("must eternal life be for the gods alone?"). There's some ambiguity here, have they seen this device in action or not? Hmmm.

Ivar is a Vine Baby. His knowledge of the device (perhaps Vine in origin?) is instinctual.

[Blood of Heroes]

1. What could and did kill Gilad? We know he died bringing The Boon back from The Faraway.

Maybe none of them are immortal until after Ivar turns on the Boon.
If that's the case, a lot of things could kill Gilad.

[jmatt]

Maybe none of them are immortal until after Ivar turns on the Boon.

If so, you'd think they'd be as afraid of the device as anyone else...

Love this title. So many unanswered questions.

Oh, and in the epilogue, we have our first confirmation that The Vine are here and operating on the planet, presumably via the vine babies (Avagis).

[Blood of Heroes]

Maybe none of them are immortal until after Ivar turns on the Boon.

If so, you'd think they'd be as afraid of the device as anyone else...

If not, Gilad would still be alive, wouldn't he?

[MarrowMan]

Maybe none of them are immortal until after Ivar turns on the Boon.

If so, you'd think they'd be as afraid of the device as anyone else...

Love this title. So many unanswered questions.

Oh, and in the epilogue, we have our first confirmation that The Vine are here and operating on the planet, presumably via the vine babies (Avagis).

huh?

[caxiotis]

If the boon brought gilad back to life, why wouldn't it bring back all the dead people in the room(e.g. the tyrant that ivar killed, the guards Armstrong killed, etc.)

[Paladon]

If the boon brought gilad back to life, why wouldn't it bring back all the dead people in the room(e.g. the tyrant that ivar killed, the guards Armstrong killed, etc.)

Maybe it did, and they just haven't told that story yet.

[MarrowMan]

If the boon brought gilad back to life, why wouldn't it bring back all the dead people in the room(e.g. the tyrant that ivar killed, the guards Armstrong killed, etc.)

Maybe it did, and they just haven't told that story yet.

If it was set up to focus only on Gilly, then it would only bring back Gilly.

[BugsySig]

If the boon brought gilad back to life, why wouldn't it bring back all the dead people in the room(e.g. the tyrant that ivar killed, the guards Armstrong killed, etc.)

Maybe it did, and they just haven't told that story yet.

If it was set up to focus only on Gilly, then it would only bring back Gilly.

Maybe there was step we havent been shown yet, like using Gilads blood to activate the device. that might explain why the 3 brothers were not killed. Ivar was holding a knife in thoae first panels (though that could have been from killing the tyrant king and his guards).

[nutflush76]

I definitely got the impression that the brothers got their powers from the Boon. Maybe they used it before? Maybe they are the only ones it gives eternal life to? I don't know, but that was my favorite part of the issue for sure.

[SJS4]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

[Heath]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

I agree. I don't think it was necessary to explain how they became immortal. That's one of the things I was thinking about when I said in another thread that I thought the original was better.

[Dr. Solar]

4. The device is situated just outside a small hallway. Gilad lies in state at the other end of the small hallway. It would seem that the device sucks in life energy on one side and blasts it out the other pointed at Gilad.

That's a good catch, I like this idea. What I wonder, if this revives Gil, will it also revive the dead king in that room as well?

[Zaphod]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

The poor writing of one does not necessarily lead to poor writing in the other. I like this explanation of how the brothers became immortal and perhaps leads to why the rest of the VEI universe is as it is, all without Solar's origin of the original Valiant Universe.

I think this is the biggest risk VEI takes in this "reboot" of these characters. You can have strong IP's out the *SQUEE* but the strength of this restarting of the Valiant Universe is it's die hard, rabid fan base.

With a complete reboot you risk alienating that fan base and thus any guaranteed sales you might have with that fan base.

[The Dirt Gang]

4. The device is situated just outside a small hallway. Gilad lies in state at the other end of the small hallway. It would seem that the device sucks in life energy on one side and blasts it out the other pointed at Gilad.

That's a good catch, I like this idea. What I wonder, if this revives Gil, will it also revive the dead king in that room as well?

+1

Going on the assumption, that possible all people in the corridor get the same immortality. Could a revived dead king be the return of the Immortal Enemy?

[SJS4]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

The poor writing of one does not necessarily lead to poor writing in the other. I like this explanation of how the brothers became immortal and perhaps leads to why the rest of the VEI universe is as it is, all without Solar's origin of the original Valiant Universe.

I think this is the biggest risk VEI takes in this "reboot" of these characters. You can have strong IP's out the *SQUEE* but the strength of this restarting of the Valiant Universe is it's die hard, rabid fan base.

With a complete reboot you risk alienating that fan base and thus any guaranteed sales you might have with that fan base.

I don't think the Eternal Warriors series was necessarily badly written, its just that by trying to "explain" everything around the immortal brothers you end up with a logical mess IMHO. Later on in the VH1 universe they tried to explain it a few times (within the context of the VHI universe) and those attempts were messy as well. I am just not sure there is a good way to explain their origin and then move on from that and tell good stories.

We will see what happens I guess, but right now this is one of the more worrisome aspects of the new valiant universe for me.

[The Dirt Gang]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

The poor writing of one does not necessarily lead to poor writing in the other. I like this explanation of how the brothers became immortal and perhaps leads to why the rest of the VEI universe is as it is, all without Solar's origin of the original Valiant Universe.

I think this is the biggest risk VEI takes in this "reboot" of these characters. You can have strong IP's out the *SQUEE* but the strength of this restarting of the Valiant Universe is it's die hard, rabid fan base.

With a complete reboot you risk alienating that fan base and thus any guaranteed sales you might have with that fan base.

I don't think the Eternal Warriors series was necessarily badly written, its just that by trying to "explain" everything around the immortal brothers you end up with a logical mess IMHO. Later on in the VH1 universe they tried to explain it a few times (within the context of the VHI universe) and those attempts were messy as well. I am just not sure there is a good way to explain their origin and then move on from that and tell good stories.

We will see what happens I guess, but right now this is one of the more worrisome aspects of the new valiant universe for me.

I didn't read VH2 but I do agree with you. Sometimes, the more left unsaid the better. I like a little ambiguity and thought it was refreshing that the VH1 Gilad and Aram didn't have a traditional origin story. They just were born the way they were born.

[cinlach@aol.com]

I have to admit, this whole "boon" thing has me the most worried not only about this series, but also about ther immortal brothers in general. This plot device reminds me way too much of the VH2 "Eternal Warriors" series (which was a mess IMHO). I am going on memory, but I believe it was a similar type of scenario in VH2 that gave the immortal brothers their "power."

The poor writing of one does not necessarily lead to poor writing in the other. I like this explanation of how the brothers became immortal and perhaps leads to why the rest of the VEI universe is as it is, all without Solar's origin of the original Valiant Universe.

I think this is the biggest risk VEI takes in this "reboot" of these characters. You can have strong IP's out the *SQUEE* but the strength of this restarting of the Valiant Universe is it's die hard, rabid fan base.

With a complete reboot you risk alienating that fan base and thus any guaranteed sales you might have with that fan base.

I don't think the Eternal Warriors series was necessarily badly written, its just that by trying to "explain" everything around the immortal brothers you end up with a logical mess IMHO. Later on in the VH1 universe they tried to explain it a few times (within the context of the VHI universe) and those attempts were messy as well. I am just not sure there is a good way to explain their origin and then move on from that and tell good stories.

We will see what happens I guess, but right now this is one of the more worrisome aspects of the new valiant universe for me.

I didn't read VH2 but I do agree with you. Sometimes, the more left unsaid the better. I like a little ambiguity and thought it was refreshing that the VH1 Gilad and Aram didn't have a traditional origin story. They just were born the way they were born.

I agreee. Sometimes it's not knowing how something works that makes it compelling. Why are they immortal? They just are.

It also means that the Valiant universe in general can be as curious about the brothers immortality as the reader and even the characters themselves are.

[Zaphod]

I contend that the mystery behind the brothers immortality is still out there. So, we know (presume) it is caused by the Boon. Just as we knew (presumed) it was caused by Solar escaping (or creating, I can't remember) a new universe is what caused the brothers to be immortal the first time.

The Boon being the cause still doesn't answer the question. It just changes it, so what is the Boon?

[jmatt]

I agreee. Sometimes it's not knowing how something works that makes it compelling. Why are they immortal? They just are.

While I'm in agreement that the simple mystery of why these brothers are immortal is interesting in that it's just "a given", who can blame VEI for wanting to tap into perhaps the biggest unanswered question from VH1?

It seems fertile ground to me. We have to stop viewing everything through the VH1 prism. I guarantee you, it's gonna be different this time around, and I welcome that.

[jmatt]

huh?

Reread the X-O sneak preview. MI-6 is being run by the Vine. "To lose one of our own... Who do we send? No Vine will go up against Shanhara, not now"... "The Council of Stems..."

They know everything about the armor, including its name and how long Aric has been time displaced.

[SJS4]

I contend that the mystery behind the brothers immortality is still out there. So, we know (presume) it is caused by the Boon. Just as we knew (presumed) it was caused by Solar escaping (or creating, I can't remember) a new universe is what caused the brothers to be immortal the first time.

The Boon being the cause still doesn't answer the question. It just changes it, so what is the Boon?

Yeah pretty sure that is exactly what "Eternal Warriors" (VH2) was devolving in to. I am going to have to check it out when I get home, but I actually think it may have even had a similar name in the VH2 series.

And who knows...maybe Van Lente and VEI will make a great story out of it...but it has me worried. We will see how it goes.

[Heath]

Okay, we've seen the intro to this book a few times before, but I wanted to think out loud about a few things.

1. What could and did kill Gilad? We know he died bringing The Boon back from The Faraway.

2. Aram doesn't seem to know how it will work ("we don't know what will happen when we turn it on") but he does seem to know its purpose; that is, he seems to believe that it works on other creatures but not if it will work on a human ("or if it even works on humans!"). However, Aram does seem to know it will kill many people.

3. Ivar, on the other hand seems to know that it will impart eternal life ("must eternal life be for the gods alone?"). There's some ambiguity here, have they seen this device in action or not? Hmmm.

Who are the Gods that are immortal thanks to The Boon? If they're not sure it works on humans, then who are they sure it works on? Where is The Faraway?

My thoughts.

The Gods are ancient aliens who use The Boon to achieve immortality. There are ton of theories out there about aliens visiting ancient man and being regarded as gods. This would really fit in with the theme of the book - that every conspiracy theory you've ever heard is true.

They're not sure it works on humans, but they know it works on those aliens. Are they The Vine? Another group of aliens?

The Faraway is another planet or perhaps a space ship belonging to these other aliens.