Harbinger: Renegade #5 Discussion

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tell
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Re: Harbinger: Renegade #5 Discussion

Post by tell »

Thegreatmagnet's review wrote:I have fundamental questions about why these events are happening. Not only does this issue not connect to or even reference a single event of the first four issues of the series, but we basically jump into the H.A.R.D. Corps minutes before attacking a U.S. city, without any explanation about who was giving the orders (their old boss is dead and his organization was dissolved). We’re dropped right into the mayhem and we don’t really know why anything is happening (especially for anyone that didn’t read Generation Zero). I feel that, in general, if you’re going to kill a character and lose those valuable assets, there should be a good reason for it... Given the near total lack of context for these events...
I don't get this criticism really. Yeah this issue was a large aside in the story, but it's part one of a story arc, there's no reason to expect answers from it. I'd say it's more likely to have very few answers if we judge by most comicbook story telling. It was supposed to excite and upset people so they buy the next issues to find out wtf happened.

As far as it not having anything to do with the Renegades, I don't think it's a large stretch of the imagination to say that this world news worthy event it going to impact the Renegades pretty heavily. I'm just guessing that the next three issues are going to be about people dealing with the fallout- Animalia joining the Renegades, missing Gen 0 kids coming out of the woodwork, mass panic amongst young psiots caused by anti-psiot bigotry and/or politics, Omen becomes a major villian, Palmer accepting the darkside or plotting against it, lots of new HARD Corps recruits, Solomon stepping or pulled into the light, maybe even Harada becoming involved in some way, ect. All of that resulting in the Renegades being forced into this coming war.

If they actually make this entire story arc without the Renegades being tied in I would agree with you, that would be bizarre.
Thegreatmagnet's review wrote:this is one of Valiant’s tentpole titles that was put on hiatus for four months, ostensibly so Robertson would have the time to do the art for the current arc.
Do we know this is what happened? I don't follow the news and social media updates like a lot of you so I haven't heard anything. I assumed this hiatus was for publishing or editorial purposes, so these issues lead into HW2 exactly when they want HW2 to start next March or whenever it is. Or that some other story element had to go to publication before this issue for some continuity reason, but I haven't put any thought into what that might have been.

If this break was just so the artist could catch up I agree with you, that's lame.

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Shadowman99
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Re: Harbinger: Renegade #5 Discussion

Post by Shadowman99 »

Okay, so I finally read this issue last night and without having read through the previous 5 pages of discussion here are my thoughts:

Have to admit, I chuckled out loud when I read this comic because my very first thought was "Okay, so Generation 0's title didn't sell so Valiant have literally just killed the franchise off", which I thought was pretty funny to be honest. I'll never know to what extent that was part of the VEI thought process, but I don't doubt for a moment that it was definitely part of it. Generation 0 have been lost at sea ever since Harbinger Wars and after their title failed it seems to me that the executive decision to keep the stable clean by well and truly axing this faction may well have been a wise one, rather than trying to keep it going on life support through subsequent attempts at new Gen 0 titles or features in other titles. Ultimately time will never tell on whether that could have been correct or not, but imo I think it might've been a wise move. Shame VEI never struck whilst the iron was still hot with Gen 0 and got a new title for them out sooner: that might have kept the faction in the foreground better and built more momentum behind the title at the time, rather than eventually re-introducing the team years after their first appearance.

I'm sure this has probably already been largely debated, but death of a major Valiant character? Nah, not imo. Generation 0 have never been 'major' players in the VU. In terms of # published issues and scale of plot-based impact on the VU Gen 0 are far, far behind the 'major' VEI players like XO Manowar and Bloodshot so to me there's no arguing that Valiant have killed off 'major' characters here. Which, I guess, ultimately means that even if VEI genuinely feel that they've done as claimed I'll disagree, but I can understand that VEI wanted to attract attention to the company through marketing and that this was a way of doing that, despite not having fulfilled on the claim by my book.

Overall, not a great issue I thought and I wasn't particularly emotionally invested in any of the characters (other than Palmer who I'm glad to see will fight another day) so I wasn't too worried to lose anyone that went. Not one of VEI's greatest moments by a long shot, but I hope that the marketing has brought in new readers to the company, which seemed on the whole the aim of the exercise.
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Re: Harbinger: Renegade #5 Discussion

Post by bygranddesign »

As someone who LOVED Dysarts Harbinger run these weren't some insignificant deaths for me.

These were some of my favorite new characters that I felt had tremendous potential.

Telic was perhaps my favorite Gen Zero character ... and her death along with Cronos was shocking and depressing.

Overall, I thought it was a BOLD issue -- effective and impactful.

I was really expecting Palmer to also get knocked off at the end while in that meeting - a bullet to the back of the head.

I'm glad he didn't -- but I think its a 50/50 chance that Palmer survives through HW2

I think the line "what happens when the United States is NO longer the highest bidder?" besides being a comment on the idea of war profiteering is also some foreshadowing ... And Palmer COULD find out with his life what happens when someone truly nefarious becomes the highest bidder.
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Re: Harbinger: Renegade #5 Discussion

Post by Shadowman99 »

bygranddesign wrote:I was really expecting Palmer to also get knocked off at the end while in that meeting - a bullet to the back of the head. I'm glad he didn't -- but I think its a 50/50 chance that Palmer survives through HW2.
Palmer's the only original member of the HARD Corps still surviving, and makes up, without a doubt, 100% of the 'glue that holds the team together' so there's no way this character will get bumped off until:
a) VEI kill off the HARD Corps faction permanently
b) A new generation of permanent (read: 'long-surviving') HARD Corps members are established and are able to constitute a cohesive unit that can handle themselves in Palmer's absence, and an adequate replacement team leader is waiting in the wings.

As it stands the current HARD Corps team are basically like kids running around holding on to their parents' hands (Palmer), so unless VEI go with option A Palmer will make it through HW2.
Kurt Busiek wrote:Bull$#!t


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