AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Bagley

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AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Bagley

Post by IMJ »

This was a pretty significant run of ASM, characterized by high profile artists, that often overshadow the fact that one of Marvel's greatest, and generally unsung writers (Micheline) did a nearly 100 issue run on the title as well.

Obviously it all starts with McFarlane's truly great pencils - and what's neat is that there's no development curve in this run like we saw on McFarlane's Hulk run. Here, he dives right in with those drawn out, caricature-like faces and dynamic posing that widely characterizes McFarlane lines and inks that people have come to love. His run is immediately followed by a Larsen run drawn completely in his signature blocky, yet animated style, and then followed again by a great Bagley run on the book that brought an old school, traditional comic-book flavor back to Spider-Man years before he would ever touch an Ultimate title. And this is all written-in by David Michelinie - the guy who wrote Venom, The Assassination Plot, Return of the Sinister Six, and some other really fun, character-driven stories.

This run on the book yields a slew of new Spider-Man characters too - Venom, Cardiac, Carnage, Styx & Stone, and of course the first Spider-Man 2099 in the terrific Anniversary issue, #365. The tail end of this run is a bit less renowned for the weirdness of Peter's parents, but Micheline ends his tenure on the book before the awful clone saga can contaminate his legacy on the book. Normally, we'd talk about these runs from the perspective of a single, combined creative team, or a single artist, but the truth is that this large chunk of Spider-Man was pretty great, with Micheline at the healm, supported by three artists with unique flavors, but all with some of the coolest line work in the industry.

When I peruse this run, my mind commonly falls on these books:

Amazing Spider-Man #300 | let's face it, this book is the most graded book at CGC for a reason. It might've been printed in droves, but it's a beautiful comic, with an iconic cover, one of the coolest villains ever created and a great story both in art and word
Amazing Spider-Man #350 | Larsen's final turn on the book and it really goes out with a bang. Rarely do you see Dr. Doom and Spider-Man brought together, and not only do you get that here, but the power levels at play are amazing and you are truly left wondering if Spider-Man is going to be wiped out in the 350th issue of his own comic.
Amazing Spider-Man #361 | Maybe a cliche pick, but it's Bagley art is terrific, the cover is iconic for it's introduction of Spidey's new psycho villain and it kicks off Marvel's pretty hardcore support of Carnage from this point forward.

This is a really unique run of Spidey books that every fan should have nicely mylar'd at home. Anyone else like these large span of Spidey's even beyond the commonly collected McFarlane books?

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by nycjadie »

This has always been Spiderman to me. This Run. Probably always will be. Classic. Whenever I find cheap McFarlane books, I always buy them.

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by Summydad1 »

Completely agree. This is Spiderman to me. ASM 300 came out when I was 7-8. All of my friends collected Spidey at that time. I stopped collecting comics all together when I was 14 (1994). The first graded book I bought when I returned to collecting (2015) was ASM 300. When I think Marvel, I think Spider-Man. Love this run. Also, ASM 301 is a beautiful cover too!
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by superman-prime »

itss a amazing run almost my fav after clearmonts x run

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by grendeljd »

It's definitely a defining run for me too - the first issue of ASM I ever bought as a kid was #284, but I actually started collecting the title at #317 when I first discovered a comic shop. And I was compelled to go back and get as many of the McFarlane/Michelinie issues that I could afford (still missing a couple to this day, but I do have that beautiful #300 :cloud9: ). Loved the book when Larsen took over too, though I missed several issues throughout his tenure as well when ASM didn't make my poor teenager budget cut...

But I have to say that in general I was never, ever impressed with Mark Bagelys art. I stayed on for a few issues here & there up to around 365-370, but his work actually turned me off the book, despite always enjoying Michelinie's stories. I took a college course on drawing comics once to get in some practice at the time, and the instructor actually used some Bagely Spider-Man stuff as an example of what *not* to do! :lol:
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by IMJ »

grendeljd wrote:I took a college course on drawing comics once to get in some practice at the time, and the instructor actually used some Bagely Spider-Man stuff as an example of what *not* to do! :lol:
That's amazing given how well renowned Bagley's Ultimate Spider-Man work has become. And all things considered, I think his pencils only ever suffered on Amazing because of coloring, rather than from the line or form work, given his style.

On the other hand, I can see how it's hard to hold him in the same caliber as McFarlane or Larsen, given their very unique and attractive styles. However, look at what Bagley accomplished. He followed those two guys on ASM in a style that was still modern, but hearkened back to a more traditional form of comic book art, yet pulled it off immediately after their runs and still amidst one of the most stylized era's of comic artwork ever.

Very clearly, enjoying artwork is a matter of personal opinion, but I've got no problems connecting Bagley's run to McFarlane and Larsen's in the spirit of this kind of thread. And by comparison, check out the not as pretty artistic fill-in work on issues like 366 & 367 and it becomes clearer that Bagley's work is a cut above the rest.

On another note, it's interesting that I'm defending his lines here so adamantly because I met the guy at a convention once to have him do an Iron Man sketch and my personal experience with him was that he was very pretentious and a little rude - you'd swear that he wanted me to beg him to do the drawing. I made it work, but I lost a lot of respect for the guy because I felt like he pre-judged me as I approached his table, and acted on that pre-judgement while interacting with me. Truth.

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by superman-prime »

after mcfarlane and larsen its hard to live up to those 2 bagley has a strong following one of hteb est and its well done compaired to many other artists

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by StarBrand »

Great thread.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by kjjohanson »

grendeljd wrote:It's definitely a defining run for me too - the first issue of ASM I ever bought as a kid was #284, but I actually started collecting the title at #317 when I first discovered a comic shop. And I was compelled to go back and get as many of the McFarlane/Michelinie issues that I could afford (still missing a couple to this day, but I do have that beautiful #300 :cloud9: ). Loved the book when Larsen took over too, though I missed several issues throughout his tenure as well when ASM didn't make my poor teenager budget cut...

But I have to say that in general I was never, ever impressed with Mark Bagelys art. I stayed on for a few issues here & there up to around 365-370, but his work actually turned me off the book, despite always enjoying Michelinie's stories. I took a college course on drawing comics once to get in some practice at the time, and the instructor actually used some Bagely Spider-Man stuff as an example of what *not* to do! :lol:
The "Gang War" storyline is when I started collecting comics too, but I think it was an issue or two later.

Michelinie's Amazing run was pretty much immediately preceded by a run on Web of Spider-man, so you can add Solo, Humbug, Chance, probably a bunch of others I'm forgetting to the list of characters he created.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by grendeljd »

kjjohanson wrote:
grendeljd wrote:It's definitely a defining run for me too - the first issue of ASM I ever bought as a kid was #284, but I actually started collecting the title at #317 when I first discovered a comic shop. And I was compelled to go back and get as many of the McFarlane/Michelinie issues that I could afford (still missing a couple to this day, but I do have that beautiful #300 :cloud9: ). Loved the book when Larsen took over too, though I missed several issues throughout his tenure as well when ASM didn't make my poor teenager budget cut...

But I have to say that in general I was never, ever impressed with Mark Bagelys art. I stayed on for a few issues here & there up to around 365-370, but his work actually turned me off the book, despite always enjoying Michelinie's stories. I took a college course on drawing comics once to get in some practice at the time, and the instructor actually used some Bagely Spider-Man stuff as an example of what *not* to do! :lol:
The "Gang War" storyline is when I started collecting comics too, but I think it was an issue or two later.

Michelinie's Amazing run was pretty much immediately preceded by a run on Web of Spider-man, so you can add Solo, Humbug, Chance, probably a bunch of others I'm forgetting to the list of characters he created.
I have only ever had a handful of issues of Web of Spidey - something I've meant to address & dig into collecting [at least the earliest issues up to #30 or so].

Turns out I'm a bit of a liar - I just rooted through my ASM's in a separate box the other day, and it seems I have nearly all the Bagley issues up to around 380 after all. Probably only missing about 10 between his start & #380. I don't remember following the title for that long, haha!

Unfortunately, I don't have #361 [1st Carnage] though... for some reason I got #360 & skipped 361 & 362 before resuming at 363^... :!: :cry:
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by StarBrand »

Love the top post in this thread, IMJ. You should have a blog or something. For the good of mankind.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by IMJ »

StarBrand wrote:Love the top post in this thread, IMJ. You should have a blog or something. For the good of mankind.
This was awesome to read. I'd love to do something like that, but after Advanced Iron petered out a bit, I became set on paid writing and haven't found an outlet for it yet....

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

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Good idea about the paid writing, IMJ.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by Cyberstrike »

It's one of those runs where because of the artists involved the writer gets overlooked but I have to agree that David Michieline while nowhere near the level of Peter David, Kurt Busik, or Mark Waid, he's one of the better writers of The Amazing Spider-Man in the 90s and much better than McFarlane was, is and every will be as a writer, and he was much better than Larsen was at the time (although Larsen has greatly improved as a writer over the years).
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by otomo »

This was the era I grew up on and ASM in this era specifically is what got me into comics. A lot of it doesn't hold up well as adult reading, but I have very fond memories. I had to have read ASM #375 with that beautiful gold foil cover like 50 times. THE FINAL BATTLE with Venom lol.

It may not have had as epic solid of storytelling as modern books do, but you know what, it was a heckuvalot more fun.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by grendeljd »

IMJ wrote:Amazing Spider-Man #361 | Maybe a cliche pick, but it's Bagley art is terrific, the cover is iconic for it's introduction of Spidey's new psycho villain and it kicks off Marvel's pretty hardcore support of Carnage from this point forward.
Any thoughts on the long term value of this issue? Obviously it's a key 1st appearance - but I was wondering what kind of potential it has to grow & retain high value. Overstreet has it at ~$80 in 9.2, but I'm seeing it go for much more than that in shops & online. I actually decided to spring for a copy for $100 yesterday at my lcs. They had multiple copies available though, another raw one was $175, and they had a CGC 9.8 for $450.

Will it ever matter that there are likely a ton of high grade copies of it based on the era it was released?
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by nycjadie »

It's old at this point, and a glut key. That being said, I think demand is outstripping availability, especially in high grade. The A newsstand or Australian Variant should be worth a mint some day.

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

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nycjadie wrote:It's old at this point, and a glut key. That being said, I think demand is outstripping availability, especially in high grade. The A newsstand or Australian Variant should be worth a mint some day.
If I understand you right, you're saying that *because* it's now an old book (25+ years old), and *despite* coming from a glut period of excess printed copies, it should remain a key value book.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by GGSAE »

My concern with ASM 361, unlike other keys is that there seems to be so many copies available. If anyone remembers my collection I bought that was heavy ASM, well it had five copies of this book (and a second print which is crazy to think that book went to a second printing). I think you’ll see more and more of that, it’s not something you see with other keys of other titles especially ASM. Having said that carnage is pretty big, so it will always be a must have book to own for a lot of people.


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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by grendeljd »

GGSAE wrote:My concern with ASM 361, unlike other keys is that there seems to be so many copies available. If anyone remembers my collection I bought that was heavy ASM, well it had five copies of this book (and a second print which is crazy to think that book went to a second printing). I think you’ll see more and more of that, it’s not something you see with other keys of other titles especially ASM. Having said that carnage is pretty big, so it will always be a must have book to own for a lot of people.


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Isn't Carnage going to be in the new Venom movie with Tom Hardy as Eddie Brock? I imagine there will be a leap in speculation pricing if thats the case.
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by maraxusofkeld »

GGSAE wrote:My concern with ASM 361, unlike other keys is that there seems to be so many copies available. If anyone remembers my collection I bought that was heavy ASM, well it had five copies of this book (and a second print which is crazy to think that book went to a second printing). I think you’ll see more and more of that, it’s not something you see with other keys of other titles especially ASM. Having said that carnage is pretty big, so it will always be a must have book to own for a lot of people.


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If there is demand for the character, I do not think the amount of copies really matter. Both Hulk 181 and NM 98 have thousands of copies but demand still seems strong.

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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by grendeljd »

maraxusofkeld wrote:
GGSAE wrote:My concern with ASM 361, unlike other keys is that there seems to be so many copies available. If anyone remembers my collection I bought that was heavy ASM, well it had five copies of this book (and a second print which is crazy to think that book went to a second printing). I think you’ll see more and more of that, it’s not something you see with other keys of other titles especially ASM. Having said that carnage is pretty big, so it will always be a must have book to own for a lot of people.


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If there is demand for the character, I do not think the amount of copies really matter. Both Hulk 181 and NM 98 have thousands of copies but demand still seems strong.
Good point. But it might be an additional factor that this book comes from a period of both high number of printed copies & collector preservation mentality. In other words, high grade copies would be more readily available. That's true for NM 98 too though, so I agree with your sentiment. Which character is considered more popular from that era though, Deadpool or Carnage?
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Re: AmazingSpider-Man#298-388|Michieline McFarlane Larsen Ba

Post by GGSAE »

maraxusofkeld wrote:
GGSAE wrote:My concern with ASM 361, unlike other keys is that there seems to be so many copies available. If anyone remembers my collection I bought that was heavy ASM, well it had five copies of this book (and a second print which is crazy to think that book went to a second printing). I think you’ll see more and more of that, it’s not something you see with other keys of other titles especially ASM. Having said that carnage is pretty big, so it will always be a must have book to own for a lot of people.


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If there is demand for the character, I do not think the amount of copies really matter. Both Hulk 181 and NM 98 have thousands of copies but demand still seems strong.
Well I don't quite think Carnage is at the same level as those books, ASM 300 would be. I see your point, do we know what how the print runs compare between the three books? I know there's been lots of discussion on the print run of NM 98.


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