Nice Job On The Paper Quality, VEI!

[StarBrand]

Lots of threads here about this subject. I wonder why?
Bill Jemas, who worked for VEI at one point, presumably as a consultant, once said "they call it comic collecting for a reason." Too bad VEI didn't take that to heart relative to paper quality. I think it's a huge mistake using such crap for paper. They're offending, and to some extent, losing their customer base with this crap. Yeah, DC does it too, and so do others. Good for them, too. I won't touch new Valiants anymore, as far as buying new books for my eBay store. I don't want anymore VF comics I paid good money for. As far as I'm concerned, offering inferior collectables to collectors could be VEI's Waterloo.
Didn't at least one of the key VEI execs used to collect comics? He needs to think back to when he was collecting, instead of listening to advice which is the same quality of the paper he's using, relative to VEI's paper quality.

[SJS4]

Lots of threads here about this subject. I wonder why?
Bill Jemas, who worked for VEI at one point, presumably as a consultant, once said "they call it comic collecting for a reason." Too bad VEI didn't take that to heart relative to paper quality. I think it's a huge mistake using such crap for paper. They're offending, and to some extent, losing their customer base with this crap. Yeah, DC does it too, and so do others. Good for them, too. I won't touch new Valiants anymore, as far as buying new books for my eBay store. I don't want anymore VF comics I paid good money for. As far as I'm concerned, offering inferior collectables to collectors could be VEI's Waterloo.
Didn't at least one of the key VEI execs used to collect comics? He needs to think back to when he was collecting, instead of listening to advice which is the same quality of the paper he's using, relative to VEI's paper quality.

The paper quality seems fine to me...? The cover stock on some issues has been "not great" but overall this seems like higher end product, not the cheap comics I was used to years ago. I pick up a few other comics now on my pull list (The Massive, Saga, BPRD/Hellboy, DHP) and I have flipped through comics on the shelves and the VEI comics seems fairly comparable to everything else out there.

[sonicdan]

I am also fine with the paper quality. The price of paper and printing is very expensive these days.
Sure, higher quality would be great but I would rather that Valiant invest in talent.
I am a serious collector, guilty of buying multiple quantities and gotta have them all...but the stories & art have to be there first.
I have been blown away by this relaunch! I could not be more pleased that my favorite characters are back and even better than before.
DAN

[tchalla8]

Lots of threads here about this subject. I wonder why?
Bill Jemas, who worked for VEI at one point, presumably as a consultant, once said "they call it comic collecting for a reason." Too bad VEI didn't take that to heart relative to paper quality. I think it's a huge mistake using such crap for paper. They're offending, and to some extent, losing their customer base with this crap. Yeah, DC does it too, and so do others. Good for them, too. I won't touch new Valiants anymore, as far as buying new books for my eBay store. I don't want anymore VF comics I paid good money for. As far as I'm concerned, offering inferior collectables to collectors could be VEI's Waterloo.
Didn't at least one of the key VEI execs used to collect comics? He needs to think back to when he was collecting, instead of listening to advice which is the same quality of the paper he's using, relative to VEI's paper quality.

don't you read your books? If you like the stories are you saying you're willing to miss out on them because they aren't Mint?

[etos45]

Lots of threads here about this subject. I wonder why?
Bill Jemas, who worked for VEI at one point, presumably as a consultant, once said "they call it comic collecting for a reason." Too bad VEI didn't take that to heart relative to paper quality. I think it's a huge mistake using such crap for paper. They're offending, and to some extent, losing their customer base with this crap. Yeah, DC does it too, and so do others. Good for them, too. I won't touch new Valiants anymore, as far as buying new books for my eBay store. I don't want anymore VF comics I paid good money for. As far as I'm concerned, offering inferior collectables to collectors could be VEI's Waterloo.
Didn't at least one of the key VEI execs used to collect comics? He needs to think back to when he was collecting, instead of listening to advice which is the same quality of the paper he's using, relative to VEI's paper quality.

don't you read your books? If you like the stories are you saying you're willing to miss out on them because they aren't Mint?

If condition really matters, one might be convinced to switch to trades if they aren't going to be collectible anyways.

I can see the frustration of paying $3.99 for a book made of poor paper quality, but mine have seemed a little better over the past month or two.

[Draco]

The variants have all been mishandled at distribution level and the paper quality might not have helped being thinner than usual, but like above pretty sure many publishers have made the cut to a thinner style at some point.

[Aram]

Lots of threads here about this subject. I wonder why?
Bill Jemas, who worked for VEI at one point, presumably as a consultant, once said "they call it comic collecting for a reason." Too bad VEI didn't take that to heart relative to paper quality. I think it's a huge mistake using such crap for paper. They're offending, and to some extent, losing their customer base with this crap. Yeah, DC does it too, and so do others. Good for them, too. I won't touch new Valiants anymore, as far as buying new books for my eBay store. I don't want anymore VF comics I paid good money for. As far as I'm concerned, offering inferior collectables to collectors could be VEI's Waterloo.
Didn't at least one of the key VEI execs used to collect comics? He needs to think back to when he was collecting, instead of listening to advice which is the same quality of the paper he's using, relative to VEI's paper quality.

don't you read your books? If you like the stories are you saying you're willing to miss out on them because they aren't Mint?

If condition really matters, one might be convinced to switch to trades if they aren't going to be collectible anyways.

I can see the frustration of paying $3.99 for a book made of poor paper quality, but mine have seemed a little better over the past month or two.

I think condition of paper in tpbs is more important. If its a poor quality tpb I will pass as I intend to read those over and over again. I see both sides. At $4 per issue you expect some decent quality though. So far I think it's been just barely ok.

[etos45]

I think condition of paper in tpbs is more important. If its a poor quality tpb I will pass as I intend to read those over and over again. I see both sides. At $4 per issue you expect some decent quality though. So far I think it's been just barely ok.

I think I'm on the opposite end of that thinking. Don't get me wrong, I want my tpbs to be durable, but I'm less concerned about keeping them in mint condition. With regular issues, I read, bag, board, and store away. The hope is that one day I can sell them to another collector that might want it (if I decide I don't anymore) or that whoever inherits them when I die can do the same. With a tpb, I am literally only paying for the story. I look at them more like regular books. I'd like them to be in good condition, but if the cover gets messed up or some pages get bent, I don't really care. Most of the tpbs I own I bought used and for less than cover.

(I guess what I'm saying is that if you ever see me selling some tpbs, you may not want to buy them )

[drmirage]

Interesting topic here. I have seen major printing problems on several key books such as:

Bloodshot #1 Regular Lozzi
Harbinger #1 1:20 Braithwaite
Harbinger #1 1:50 QR Djurdjevic
Harbinger #2 1:20 Braithwaite

I will be posting images of these problems relating to Harbinger #1 1:20 & 1:50 since I have not seen there posted anywhere.



Back Bottom Right, I have seen these vertical lines appear in several books including Bloodshot #1 1:50 and Harbinger #1 1:50




Back, I know this is a comon problem for every comic book, but it happens so much easier with the new VEI books.


Back Top Left, I am not sure what this is called, but I can assume its the process of cutting the books. Top is damaged.


Back Middle Left, I am also not sure what created these lines going up and down of the back of the books.
Majority of the Harbinger 1:50 and 1:25 have these.





Front Top Right, There's a crack going at an angle on the top right of the book. Is this due to the paper or printing process?



-------------------------

Regarding the very thin cover stock, I think if the books had thicker cover stock we would see better condition on the books:

Valiant Summer 2012 Preview
X-O Manowar #1 3rd Printing

All of the countless copies I have seen of these books, they all have one thing in common. Multiple spine stress due to the thin cover. Even when reading the book with extreme care, there is no way you can casually read these books without damaging it.

----------------------

On the other hand, suprisingly, I have also seen books that have come out in near perfect condition.

X-O Manowar 1 2nd Print
Bloodshot #1 1:20 Aja
X-O Manowar #1 1:20 Aja
X-O Manowar #3 1:20 Suayan

---------------------

If someone were to know about how the conditions of VEi's new books are in. CKB, the member who is attempting to gather a 9.8 VEI master set can sure tell you all about it. He has seen hundreds, if not thousands of VEI books since the relaunch.

[VEI Reborn]

In one hand I am happy about it. In another it upsets me especially when I pick up 30-40 copies of a book and 25-30% are damaged. What keeps me from being super upset is that I think the 9.8s will be worth more because of it. lol

[FormerReader]

Dr. Mirage, Many of those issues look familiar. I have the same issues with the same defects. I agree I have been disappointed in the quality of the paper. I am very picky on condition and it is disappointing spending money and getting a brand new book with defects. That being said as long as Valiant continues to put out great stories I will overlook the paper issues.

[arghh!]

Mine are coming in beat to heck too. I bought an X-O gold and it had 3 spine ticks and that one has a card stock cover. Many are miscut badly as well. My Harbinger 4 is cut through the bar code and has a white stripe of equal size across the top. It goes through the little review blurb at the bottom. When I consider what I have been spending on this stuff it is a little disheartening.

[greg]

My Harbinger 4 is cut through the bar code and has a white stripe of equal size across the top. It goes through the little review blurb at the bottom.

Since there isn't an incentive cover for Harbinger #4, you may have discovered the "variant" that people want to find in the future.

I can see it now:

Harbinger #4 (2012) - PRINTER ERROR - WHITE STRIPE VARIANT - ONLY $399!!!

[jmatt]

At $4 per issue you expect some decent quality though. So far I think it's been just barely ok.

That's kinda my thinking too. The page stock seems a little thin but I appreciate the glossy pages. But for $3.99, the coverstock should be killer.

But we've covered this ground before...

[xodacia81]

I haven't noticed a difference compared to other books I currently purchase, aside from Fables, which is on a different stock much more in keeping with books from the 80's and 90's. I think the move to glossier, thinner stock is a modern aesthetic thing. It doesn't bother me because I'm not in it for a profit. Completion, yes, but turning a profit? That's a side bet for waaaaaay down the road on a potential hill called maybe.

[Elveen]

I haven't noticed a difference compared to other books I currently purchase, aside from Fables, which is on a different stock much more in keeping with books from the 80's and 90's. I think the move to glossier, thinner stock is a modern aesthetic thing. It doesn't bother me because I'm not in it for a profit. Completion, yes, but turning a profit? That's a side bet for waaaaaay down the road on a potential hill called maybe.

I personally like the physical "feel" of Fables. It's different in a good way, and for some reason it seems to "fit" the book.

[xodacia81]

I haven't noticed a difference compared to other books I currently purchase, aside from Fables, which is on a different stock much more in keeping with books from the 80's and 90's. I think the move to glossier, thinner stock is a modern aesthetic thing. It doesn't bother me because I'm not in it for a profit. Completion, yes, but turning a profit? That's a side bet for waaaaaay down the road on a potential hill called maybe.

I personally like the physical "feel" of Fables. It's different in a good way, and for some reason it seems to "fit" the book.

Quite. I think it adds a certain "authenticity" to the book, as though you are reading from something slightly aged or hidden/preserved. A really cool book all around.

[MoonChild]

Unfortunately I have to agree, most of my VEI books were purchased VF/NM- range. Would love to see an improvement on this.

[drmirage]

I think this is in reference to Harbinger #1 Regular Cover.

One of mine has an extra word balloon not seen in other books. I need to scan and post this.

My Harbinger 4 is cut through the bar code and has a white stripe of equal size across the top. It goes through the little review blurb at the bottom.

Since there isn't an incentive cover for Harbinger #4, you may have discovered the "variant" that people want to find in the future.

I can see it now:

Harbinger #4 (2012) - PRINTER ERROR - WHITE STRIPE VARIANT - ONLY $399!!!

[rjrjr]

Dr. Mirage, Many of those issues look familiar. I have the same issues with the same defects. I agree I have been disappointed in the quality of the paper. I am very picky on condition and it is disappointing spending money and getting a brand new book with defects. That being said as long as Valiant continues to put out great stories I will overlook the paper issues.

Surprisingly, this is a common problem for the variants from many of the publishers. I've seen this on IDW's Star Trek variants, Boom's Planet of the Apes variants, Avatar's Fevre Dream variants, Dynamite Entertainment's Buck Rogers and Battlestar Galactica variants, etc. (To be fair most of Dynamite Entertainment's comics have defects. Not sure what printer they use, but getting NM copies of Dynamite Entertainment comics can be a chore at times.) Maybe this is an inherent problem with variants due to the lower number of copies? It's funny, the less copies of a modern comic, the more likely it is that it will have a defect. And those are the comics you pay the most for.

[drmirage]

I dont really have knowledge of how the other publishers have printing problems, but I am sure that what you are saying it true. I do know that Dark Horse has great printers. Looking recenty on the first Dark Key books and as I recall, this was not an issue and the books were $3.50 and were in NM/M condition when they came out. I've also purchased Massive 1-3 and all were in great shape from the LCS from the stands. (Sad to say...I don't buy any other books outside of VEI.)

Regarding about price points, Valiant (VHI) in the 90's were priced at $1.95, $2.25, $2.50 for their books. They were far superior in quality. Look at the early issues of Shadoman, Archer and Armstrong and Harbinger. They were very nice at that time. Right now, I cannot even compare. VEI should try to talk if they printers from VH1 are still in business.

Surprisingly, this is a common problem for the variants from many of the publishers. I've seen this on IDW's Star Trek variants, Boom's Planet of the Apes variants, Avatar's Fevre Dream variants, Dynamite Entertainment's Buck Rogers and Battlestar Galactica variants, etc. (To be fair most of Dynamite Entertainment's comics have defects. Not sure what printer they use, but getting NM copies of Dynamite Entertainment comics can be a chore at times.) Maybe this is an inherent problem with variants due to the lower number of copies? It's funny, the less copies of a modern comic, the more likely it is that it will have a defect. And those are the comics you pay the most for.

[rjrjr]

I dont really have knowledge of how the other publishers have printing problems, but I am sure that what you are saying it true. I do know that Dark Horse has great printers. Looking recenty on the first Dark Key books and as I recall, this was not an issue and the books were $3.50 and were in NM/M condition when they came out. I've also purchased Massive 1-3 and all were in great shape from the LCS from the stands. (Sad to say...I don't buy any other books outside of VEI.)

Regarding about price points, Valiant (VHI) in the 90's were priced at $1.95, $2.25, $2.50 for their books. They were far superior in quality. Look at the early issues of Shadoman, Archer and Armstrong and Harbinger. They were very nice at that time. Right now, I cannot even compare. VEI should try to talk if they printers from VH1 are still in business.

Surprisingly, this is a common problem for the variants from many of the publishers. I've seen this on IDW's Star Trek variants, Boom's Planet of the Apes variants, Avatar's Fevre Dream variants, Dynamite Entertainment's Buck Rogers and Battlestar Galactica variants, etc. (To be fair most of Dynamite Entertainment's comics have defects. Not sure what printer they use, but getting NM copies of Dynamite Entertainment comics can be a chore at times.) Maybe this is an inherent problem with variants due to the lower number of copies? It's funny, the less copies of a modern comic, the more likely it is that it will have a defect. And those are the comics you pay the most for.

The Dark Key comics were in terrific condition through the entire short run. And with the first issue on all those titles being double sized to boot. Dark Horse has problems from time to time with their printer though. You can especially see the problem on the Hellboy titles (black covers) and I've had my share of printer defects on the Star Wars titles, but usually only with the back cover. IDW was doing this correct a few years ago with their heavier stock covers. If you are going to charge $3.99, you should make sure you are getting quality books off the press. I miss those heavier covers.

Absolutely the worst publisher however is Dynamite Entertainment. Notice many E-Bay new issue sellers list their new comics at NM or better condition, with the exception of Dynamite Entertainment's titles, which they list as VF or better condition. Their printer is the worst.

[Chiclo]

I haven't noticed a difference compared to other books I currently purchase, aside from Fables, which is on a different stock much more in keeping with books from the 80's and 90's. I think the move to glossier, thinner stock is a modern aesthetic thing. It doesn't bother me because I'm not in it for a profit. Completion, yes, but turning a profit? That's a side bet for waaaaaay down the road on a potential hill called maybe.

I personally like the physical "feel" of Fables. It's different in a good way, and for some reason it seems to "fit" the book.

Quite. I think it adds a certain "authenticity" to the book, as though you are reading from something slightly aged or hidden/preserved. A really cool book all around.

After Fables 120, I am not sure I can continue to like the book.

[ckb]

As far as I can tell, the cover stock on all the variants has been upgraded to something acceptable. I'd like something stiffer like the DC Watchmen #1 covers but I think it is good enough.

I do think the interior paper quality left something to be desired this month. I'm not sure how much of that is the printer versus VEI, though. At the end of the day anything they can do to cut costs to survive has to be OK. Once they break into other media and have more revenue streams I think they will be more able to pick up the quality.

[FormerReader]

I would like to say the Harbinger #4 and X-O #5 I picked up today looked much better. I only had one damaged book out of the four copies. I think the stiffer cover is a dramatic improvement!