Bloodshot and H.A.R.D. Corps #16 Discussion

[Spylocke]

I have to wonder just how cheap these implants are if they are being used on such obvious coffin stuffers like the newest recruits.
If the nanites come back into the possession of PRS maybe they can be integrated into the implants to mitigate their side effects. It's hard not to think of the Psi-Lords when Bloodshot and H.A.R.D. Corps are working together.

[BugsySig]

I have to wonder just how cheap these implants are if they are being used on such obvious coffin stuffers like the newest recruits.
If the nanites come back into the possession of PRS maybe they can be integrated into the implants to mitigate their side effects. It's hard not to think of the Psi-Lords when Bloodshot and H.A.R.D. Corps are working together.

I don't think the tech is that rare, rather the individuals capable of using it.

And yes, PsiLords seems like an obvious marriage of the two concepts down the line.

[Baramos]

We're the whole way to page two and nobody mentions how creepy that Johnny killbot thing is?! Nightmare fuel.

[hunter_peterson]

We're the whole way to page two and nobody mentions how creepy that Johnny killbot thing is?! Nightmare fuel.

He likes to be called Lysander.

I really hope they build him up as an archenemy for Bloodshot. It would be cool if they combined him with the Rampage concept, perhaps, as an evolution of his current people-limbed spider thing. Maybe have him be gold this time? Anyway, they could build a very personal enemy that will fight against Bloodshot no matter what he's currently involved in (so not a PRS enemy, but a Bloodshot one). Maybe some Malev Emperor thrown in for good measure? He could definitely survive all the way into the future as the first freewill.

Either way, he's pretty awesome and I hope he sticks around for a while.

[hawkeyeps]

We're the whole way to page two and nobody mentions how creepy that Johnny killbot thing is?! Nightmare fuel.

He likes to be called Lysander.

I really hope they build him up as an archenemy for Bloodshot. It would be cool if they combined him with the Rampage concept, perhaps, as an evolution of his current people-limbed spider thing. Maybe have him be gold this time? Anyway, they could build a very personal enemy that will fight against Bloodshot no matter what he's currently involved in (so not a PRS enemy, but a Bloodshot one). Maybe some Malev Emperor thrown in for good measure? He could definitely survive all the way into the future as the first freewill.

Either way, he's pretty awesome and I hope he sticks around for a while.

Is there a Dr.Silk angle here

[Watchtower]

Dysart is a freaking miracle worker. He's taken a book that's been floundering since Harbinger Wars and has made it straight-up awesome, and he's not even the one doing the writing. Valiant should seriously give him a little more freedom in calling the shots because he clearly knows what he's doing. Besides, can't be worse than Geoff Johns getting his fingerprints all over the entire DCnU.

Every word out of Kozol's mouth makes me want to put a gun to his head myself. It's like he's actively competing for "world's biggest scumbag" and has no idea he's the only horse on the track. His attempt to justify "Genius"'s enlistment beyond blatant Loophole Abuse is just hilarious.

Also, every scene with Lifeline and the "joystick junkies" is reminding me of League of Legends. "You've got Gunslinger and you let our AD carry get ganked! OMG reporting."

Liking the development with ol' Lysander. Honestly didn't anticipate him reaching the Singularity so quickly, though I can't help but feel it a little forced. Curious to see if it's an act or not.

[Captain Craig]

I think the book was a great read before. I will say the HARD Corps edition has upped thy dynamic and I'm enjoying the title even more than before.

[Knightt]

Flatline having Cystic Fibrosis was a really nice nod from Valiant.

[jmatt]

I'll just say that I agree with most everything that's been posted in this thread. What a great issue! I was worried, but having BS team up with HardCorps is terrific!

And it's cool we get to see Johnny in action so soon. The kid is demonic.

What role is Dysart playing with the book? Co-writer? Plotter?

[Dallow Spicer1]

Didn't enjoy this issue that much, I think it's mainly because I can't get past the art which is so unsuited to this book. I like the backgrounds of the new recruits, I thought they all had interesting motivations for joining Hard CORPS. I still don't this this book has hit the highs of the earlier issues (1-5).

2/5 (lost a point for that editing howler with the severed finger).

[Bl00dsh0t]

We're the whole way to page two and nobody mentions how creepy that Johnny killbot thing is?! Nightmare fuel.

He likes to be called Lysander.

I really hope they build him up as an archenemy for Bloodshot. It would be cool if they combined him with the Rampage concept, perhaps, as an evolution of his current people-limbed spider thing. Maybe have him be gold this time? Anyway, they could build a very personal enemy that will fight against Bloodshot no matter what he's currently involved in (so not a PRS enemy, but a Bloodshot one). Maybe some Malev Emperor thrown in for good measure? He could definitely survive all the way into the future as the first freewill.

Either way, he's pretty awesome and I hope he sticks around for a while.

I think this is a great idea

Would love to see an emeny specific to Bloodshot that lasts a long time rather than a one and done encounter. Lysander would also add another Valiant villain to mix (which we know they are lacking).

[grendeljd]

I really enjoyed the issue but one thing kind of bothers me. I'll have to re-read it to see if I was just in an off mood at the time, but I thought that Johnny/Lysander becoming immediately 'evil' felt a little forced & arbitrary.

It was creepy as all-get-out to see the machine start dissecting bodies & attach pieces to itself, but I don't understand the motivation to be warped from the get-go. The thing clearly seeks its own independence from Bloodshot & doesn't want to merge back with him, I get that & think its a great source of motivation, but the warped behaviour aspect just felt like it didn't fit. I expect we'll see the character get fleshed out more [see what I did there?] in issues to come, the writing is excellent otherwise.

And I hate to echo negative sentiments, but as much as I dearly love Luppachino's artwork [seriously, it is top notch], it still feels out of place on this title. Too polished & clean for such a gritty concept. I do hope the lads are putting her on another title after this arc - I want to see more of her work within Valiant, I thought she was very well suited to A&A in particular.

[caxiotis]

Just read this issue and really enjoying Bloodshot & the HARD Corps. Ever since the book switched from Swierczyski to Dysart & Gage the book has gotten better.

[Big Red]

This book is great!

It's one of Valiant's best!

Palmer is one of my favorite characters.

[leonmallett]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particularly in terms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

[Dallow Spicer1]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particulalry in therms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

Yeah, I agree with this. They need to de-power BS not make him more powerful. The signs of him being de-powered are there as he has lost some nanites do his recovery is reduced. But yeah, growing new limbs and being able to 'temporarily' change appearance seems a bit much!

[blujay]

We're the whole way to page two and nobody mentions how creepy that Johnny killbot thing is?! Nightmare fuel.

He kinda reminds me of a more horrifying version of that baby/spider toy from Toy Story. And that thing scared the *SQUEE* out of me as a kid

[ThatDarnCabbage]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particulalry in therms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

Yeah, I agree with this. They need to de-power BS not make him more powerful. The signs of him being de-powered are there as he has lost some nanites do his recovery is reduced. But yeah, growing new limbs and being able to 'temporarily' change appearance seems a bit much!

But then again, he tends to lose almost every fight with anyone who isn't a random, normal soldier. He did okay with Chainsaw, but he couldn't take on Gamma, it took Pulse to kill that guy from the first arc, he almost got Harada but Ion stopped him, and he got his *SQUEE* kicked by Peter. Plus Toyo seems to be winning this second fight. As powerful as he is he hasn't taken down any major threats really besides Chainsaw. I want to see him single-handedly win more major fights, but now that he's basically in a team book, that may not happen very often.

[blujay]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particulalry in therms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

Yeah, I agree with this. They need to de-power BS not make him more powerful. The signs of him being de-powered are there as he has lost some nanites do his recovery is reduced. But yeah, growing new limbs and being able to 'temporarily' change appearance seems a bit much!

But then again, he tends to lose almost every fight with anyone who isn't a random, normal soldier. He did okay with Chainsaw, but he couldn't take on Gamma, it took Pulse to kill that guy from the first arc, he almost got Harada but Ion stopped him, and he got his *SQUEE* kicked by Peter. Plus Toyo seems to be winning this second fight. As powerful as he is he hasn't taken down any major threats really besides Chainsaw. I want to see him single-handedly win more major fights, but now that he's basically in a team book, that may not happen very often.

I give him round 1 with Harada, he outright whooped his *SQUEE*. And we have seen he is hypothetically capable of killing all the renegades in a matter of seconds.

I think Bloodshot's powers just need to be a little more defined (ie what can't his nanites do to technology/what are their limits?), he's tough but he's far from unkillable

[hunter_peterson]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particulalry in therms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

Yeah, I agree with this. They need to de-power BS not make him more powerful. The signs of him being de-powered are there as he has lost some nanites do his recovery is reduced. But yeah, growing new limbs and being able to 'temporarily' change appearance seems a bit much!

But then again, he tends to lose almost every fight with anyone who isn't a random, normal soldier. He did okay with Chainsaw, but he couldn't take on Gamma, it took Pulse to kill that guy from the first arc, he almost got Harada but Ion stopped him, and he got his *SQUEE* kicked by Peter. Plus Toyo seems to be winning this second fight. As powerful as he is he hasn't taken down any major threats really besides Chainsaw. I want to see him single-handedly win more major fights, but now that he's basically in a team book, that may not happen very often.

I give him round 1 with Harada, he outright whooped his *SQUEE*. And we have seen he is hypothetically capable of killing all the renegades in a matter of seconds.

I think Bloodshot's powers just need to be a little more defined (ie what can't his nanites do to technology/what are their limits?), he's tough but he's far from unkillable

Yeah, I don't think Bloodshot is overpowered. Powerful, sure, but not overly. The psiot implants were said to be "healed" away after a few hours, so that could never be permanent. The healing is currently reduced somewhat, where it actually will take time for major injuries to heal. Plus the protein limitation on that is a good story tool to keep it in control. His ability to change appearance was said to be limited in both time and how much he can change, and he can only control simple computers without directly applying his blood to them. He sounds a lot more overpowered than he is in practice.

[leonmallett]

Another enjoyable issue for me. I did not mind the art; it did what it needed to for me as a reader, and did not seem unfitting as i was reading. But then tastes do vary.

While I am enjoying this new era for the book, particulalry in therms of the story and narrative, I am getting concerned with the overloading of capability of our protagonists, from Palmer's introduction of sequenced uploads (which still does not quite pass the logic test for me of responsiveness in battle conditions if the one at a time limit remains), to tacking on HARDCorps powers to Bloodshot. Bloodshot is a bit of a monster power-wise as it is, and ramping him up further just runs the risk of losing any sense of vulnerability; I would hate for him to end up with such a suite of powers he is covered for every eventuality for a couple of reasons. Firstly rolling that back can be tricky in story terms. And secondly, it risks reducing dramatic tension based on the perceived limits of the character.

Yeah, I agree with this. They need to de-power BS not make him more powerful. The signs of him being de-powered are there as he has lost some nanites do his recovery is reduced. But yeah, growing new limbs and being able to 'temporarily' change appearance seems a bit much!

But then again, he tends to lose almost every fight with anyone who isn't a random, normal soldier. He did okay with Chainsaw, but he couldn't take on Gamma, it took Pulse to kill that guy from the first arc, he almost got Harada but Ion stopped him, and he got his *SQUEE* kicked by Peter. Plus Toyo seems to be winning this second fight. As powerful as he is he hasn't taken down any major threats really besides Chainsaw. I want to see him single-handedly win more major fights, but now that he's basically in a team book, that may not happen very often.

I give him round 1 with Harada, he outright whooped his *SQUEE*. And we have seen he is hypothetically capable of killing all the renegades in a matter of seconds.

I think Bloodshot's powers just need to be a little more defined (ie what can't his nanites do to technology/what are their limits?), he's tough but he's far from unkillable

Yeah, I don't think Bloodshot is overpowered. Powerful, sure, but not overly. The psiot implants were said to be "healed" away after a few hours, so that could never be permanent. The healing is currently reduced somewhat, where it actually will take time for major injuries to heal. Plus the protein limitation on that is a good story tool to keep it in control. His ability to change appearance was said to be limited in both time and how much he can change, and he can only control simple computers without directly applying his blood to them. He sounds a lot more overpowered than he is in practice.

The problem with the implants, even if 'healed away', is that right now they are a plug-in that can be dropped back in seemingly at any time. Flying Bloodshot? Ugh, no thanks. Yet that seems to be a possibility on the table when taken to logical conclusion.

For me his base suite of powers (regeneration/healing; electronic control/interface; enhanced strength; even the morphing) are more than adequate. It is the implants that just expose the character to the risk becoming omni-capable, and therefore at risk of losing dramatic tension.

[lorddunlow]

I have no problem with Bloodshot's power level. Solar was my favorite from VH1 and you can't get much more powerful than that (although Harada and some other psiots were able to give him a run for his money).

[Phantom]

Flatline having Cystic Fibrosis was a really nice nod from Valiant.

Just read the issue.
I think it fantastic that valiant have used a mentally disabled ? Low IQ person, who some of society do call 'retarded'.

For some of us it is only a hope or dream, that their son will even be able to get a job and work.
Made me smile.

Also the young lady that has Cystic Fibrosis.

Getting the feeling that the hardcorps team players don't hang around long ~ but you never know. Still an interesting point, origin of charactors

[rpellech83]

This was the first book I read out of my shipment this month because I couldn't wait. I love the art and story and the contrasts. The heavy story mixed with the lighter art makes the events more startling to me. I also like how much Kozol is like Harada. Harada judges them for creating weapons instead of helping people while still being a power mad villain. Kozol is using people but saying look the tech makes their lives better even though theu're expendable. It's a nice dynamic.

[krylox]

this book has become a fantastic read. the pacing, the dialogue, the action... probably my fav vei series right now. it's even slightly better than harbinger nowdays.