Archer & Armstrong #25 Discussion

[Keith]

Continuing the tradition of these strong 25th issue celebrations, I thought this was a great send off issue. The main portion wraps up many outstanding items from the A&A run, and leads into the beginning of The Delinquents. At first I thought the ending with the formation of the Archies was a little too "I need to wrap this up" on Van Lente's part (especially given the glimpses we've seen of them during the Faraway arc), but I guess there is just more that remains to be seen in the development of Archer as the Darwin of the Soul in the future Valiant Universe. I do hope we will get to see more.

Immortal Combat was funny. Not much more to say there... nicely done.

The One Percent piece was a nice lead in to the one-shot special. Curious to see if Valiant is going to continue developing this? Maybe Ray Fawkes will be heading up an Archer & Armstrong mini-series sometime in 2015?

First Rounds On Me. Now that is good stuff. Love that it tied back into the Pub Crawl!

While I haven't been a big fan of the Justin Jordan/Rafer Roberts shorts in the other 25ers, Bar Talk was pretty well done. Loved the glimpse of Armstrong in the 90s, hanging out with the original Valiant characters!

I really loved the final one page Happy Returns. Made me really sad, but it was nice at the same time and a touching end to the finale of Archer & Armstrong.

Just hitting me now how much I am going to miss this series each month. It's been a wonderful ride, and will remain a highlight for me when looking back on this iteration of Valiant (long may it continue!) Thanks to FVL and all the other creative involved!

[BugsySig]

Wow. I really loved all of these stories.

Just when you think FVL has brought everything full circle, we get the birth of The Archies! Loved it. And damn can Clayton Henry draw. And I agree it leads right into Delinquents in continuity.

Oh...and did anyone catch that Archer's real name is "Barry"? Nice little nod their.

Immortal Combat was fun and just goes to show how carefree Armstrong is.

The 1% was a good little lead in for the upcoming one-shot. I also liked the "Wolves of Wallstreet" in the initial story.

Aram buying himself his first beer was amazing.

Justin Jordan's story was actually really good. Great cameos in the VH1 bar scene.

The final tale was very heartfelt and really makes you understand how much Archer means to Aram. It also gave us our THIRD reference to the future in this issue. Could we be seeing Aram show up in 4001

[dornwolf]

The final tale was very heartfelt and really makes you understand how much Archer means to Aram. It also gave us our THIRD reference to the future in this issue. Could we be seeing Aram show up in 4001

Does seem that way doesn't it. Would almost have to at some point since as Fred writing a time traveler next so I'd almost expect a 4001 arc at some point. Would actually be a great way to grow out the 4001 era to be honest.

[the1captain]

Great issue. A & A has been my favourite of the new era of Valiant. Usually don't care for back ups. But each back up story was great. I couldn't get into the Deliquents as one reason was it didn't feel it fit into the story here. But with the ending here I can see how this leads into that story. Well done.

Loved, loved the old Valiant shout out.

OTV better dedicate an entire episode to this issue!

[mateo107]

great issue, although I was hoping Archer's real parents would have had a moment of closure. I mean, why would a stranger about the same age, sex, and hair color of your missing son come by and start asking personal questions about your family? another page of them figuring it out on their own would have been a more satisfying conclusion, but maybe that's just me.

[the1captain]

great issue, although I was hoping Archer's real parents would have had a moment of closure. I mean, why would a stranger about the same age, sex, and hair color of your missing son come by and start asking personal questions about your family? another page of them figuring it out on their own would have been a more satisfying conclusion, but maybe that's just me.

Gotta admit I thought it was weird they didn't even notice the resemblance.

[jmatt]

What a great issue. I could read FVL and Henry all day long.

Enjoyed every piece, what a treat.

[bygranddesign]

I felt like the main story was a bit underwhelming. Rarely have I ever felt that way by an FVL A&A issue. But it just didn't hit the mark for me ... The comedy felt a little forced at times ... And what could have been a nice moment in reuniting with his parents I think was a missed opportunity and really didn't draw out the emotion that it could have. I think Archer's reasoning for not telling his parents that he is their son was ok ... But not wholly convincing. And agreed about how could his parents not have recognized him ... He basically looked the same as his kid picture.

Dont want to be too negative - it was still pretty good with Henry's normal excellent, clean artwork.

The rest of the stories were pretty good with some nice moments. The 1% story was pretty effective in getting me more interested in reading the one shot next month.

[jmatt]

Oh, and I wanted to mention that I love the cover with them dancing. It makes me smile every time I look at it. I can't even put my finger on it... just two dudes feeling a vibe and celebrating their souls... or something. Serious, but having some fun.

Love it.

[lorddunlow]

Nooooooooooo!

I'm gonna kick and scream and stomp until VEI and FVL keep this book going!

Loved the issue.

I would pay $4 just for the panel in Justin Jordan's story with Geoff!

[erwinrafael]

great issue, although I was hoping Archer's real parents would have had a moment of closure. I mean, why would a stranger about the same age, sex, and hair color of your missing son come by and start asking personal questions about your family? another page of them figuring it out on their own would have been a more satisfying conclusion, but maybe that's just me.

Gotta admit I thought it was weird they didn't even notice the resemblance.

In my experience, though, I had friends from my childhood that I was not able to recognize after not seeing them for more than a decade. So it's not that unlikely.

[the1captain]

great issue, although I was hoping Archer's real parents would have had a moment of closure. I mean, why would a stranger about the same age, sex, and hair color of your missing son come by and start asking personal questions about your family? another page of them figuring it out on their own would have been a more satisfying conclusion, but maybe that's just me.

Gotta admit I thought it was weird they didn't even notice the resemblance.

In my experience, though, I had friends from my childhood that I was not able to recognize after not seeing them for more than a decade. So it's not that unlikely.

True. On the other hand when his mom is looking at a picture of him at the same time she is looking at him and the picture looks almost identical to him one has to wonder. Still though a minor point.

[Dallow Spicer1]

This is the first issue of A&A I've picked up in a while (although I am reading Delinquents), the 'Billie Jean' tribute cover drew me in! I'll avoid being negative about this issue as the regular readers seemed to really like it, but let's just say this still isn't the book for me and I plan to avoid Timewalker when that comes out.

However, I am curious about a piece of continuity I'm hoping someone can clear up for me? At the start of the issue the implication is that Archer is speaking up his natural parents who 'lost' their son who was aged 10. I seem to remember the cover to A&A #0 showing Archer as a baby already in PRS, so how does that work? Either the cover wasn't accurate or that couple aren't his real parents?

[lorddunlow]

This is the first issue of A&A I've picked up in a while (although I am reading Delinquents), the 'Billie Jean' tribute cover drew me in! I'll avoid being negative about this issue as the regular readers seemed to really like it, but let's just say this still isn't the book for me and I plan to avoid Timewalker when that comes out.

However, I am curious about a piece of continuity I'm hoping someone can clear up for me? At the start of the issue the implication is that Archer is speaking up his natural parents who 'lost' their son who was aged 10. I seem to remember the cover to A&A #0 showing Archer as a baby already in PRS, so how does that work? Either the cover wasn't accurate or that couple aren't his real parents?

Cover wasn't accurate

[erwinrafael]

Cover was correct symbolically.

[Dallow Spicer1]

This is the first issue of A&A I've picked up in a while (although I am reading Delinquents), the 'Billie Jean' tribute cover drew me in! I'll avoid being negative about this issue as the regular readers seemed to really like it, but let's just say this still isn't the book for me and I plan to avoid Timewalker when that comes out.

However, I am curious about a piece of continuity I'm hoping someone can clear up for me? At the start of the issue the implication is that Archer is speaking up his natural parents who 'lost' their son who was aged 10. I seem to remember the cover to A&A #0 showing Archer as a baby already in PRS, so how does that work? Either the cover wasn't accurate or that couple aren't his real parents?

Cover wasn't accurate

Cheers LD

[jmatt]

This is the first issue of A&A I've picked up in a while (although I am reading Delinquents), the 'Billie Jean' tribute cover drew me in! I'll avoid being negative about this issue as the regular readers seemed to really like it, but let's just say this still isn't the book for me and I plan to avoid Timewalker when that comes out.

However, I am curious about a piece of continuity I'm hoping someone can clear up for me? At the start of the issue the implication is that Archer is speaking up his natural parents who 'lost' their son who was aged 10. I seem to remember the cover to A&A #0 showing Archer as a baby already in PRS, so how does that work? Either the cover wasn't accurate or that couple aren't his real parents?

Cover wasn't accurate

Struth. The covers are not an accurate way to gauge content.

[Chiclo]

This is the first issue of A&A I've picked up in a while (although I am reading Delinquents), the 'Billie Jean' tribute cover drew me in! I'll avoid being negative about this issue as the regular readers seemed to really like it, but let's just say this still isn't the book for me and I plan to avoid Timewalker when that comes out.

However, I am curious about a piece of continuity I'm hoping someone can clear up for me? At the start of the issue the implication is that Archer is speaking up his natural parents who 'lost' their son who was aged 10. I seem to remember the cover to A&A #0 showing Archer as a baby already in PRS, so how does that work? Either the cover wasn't accurate or that couple aren't his real parents?

Cover wasn't accurate

Struth. The covers are not an accurate way to gauge content.

Ostrich?

[QUARTZ]

Aram buying himself that first beer was awesome.

Love this title, definitely excited to see what is in store for Timewalker. I'm guessing we see Aram pop up later...4001 here we come...

[Aomalle27]

yuck, its issues like this that makes me put my Valiant pulls at the bottom of my reading list. The template VEI is using for their #25 issues just sucks. A couple of short tales bunched together, 1 of which is invariably drawn like a 2 year old ut it to paper, and a total distraction from the ongoing narrative. This is how A&A goes out? quite uncerimoniously....

[erwinrafael]

Armstrong: Can’t trust a man who doesn’t claim any vices. It’s an early warning sign for smugness, self-righteousness, and blindness to one’s own faults. You don’t drink, but you’ve never tried to drink. Where we’re going, and what you’re gonna see, are gonna challenge everything you think you know about who and what you are. You judge and reject things outta hand, well, then, you’re not really the kinda student I want.

Archer: I never tried jumping off a bridge, but I know I wouldn’t like that, either.

Armstrong: And I’m not asking you to jump off a bridge. One pint, that’s all.

Archer: Mr. Armstrong, you can’t force me to drink if I don’t want to.

Armstrong: Nor will I. I’M ASKING YOU TO CHOOSE.

----------

What a perfect sendoff. Thank you, Mr. Van Lente.

[QUARTZ]

Armstrong: Can’t trust a man who doesn’t claim any vices. It’s an early warning sign for smugness, self-righteousness, and blindness to one’s own faults. You don’t drink, but you’ve never tried to drink. Where we’re going, and what you’re gonna see, are gonna challenge everything you think you know about who and what you are. You judge and reject things outta hand, well, then, you’re not really the kinda student I want.

Archer: I never tried jumping off a bridge, but I know I wouldn’t like that, either.

Armstrong: And I’m not asking you to jump off a bridge. One pint, that’s all.

Archer: Mr. Armstrong, you can’t force me to drink if I don’t want to.

Armstrong: Nor will I. I’M ASKING YOU TO CHOOSE.

----------

What a perfect sendoff. Thank you, Mr. Van Lente.

The thing that didn't really make sense to me is how this fit into Delinquents, where he is drinking absenth and willingly being corrupted by Woody. Seems like he already made his choice there. In terms of continuity I thought it would make more sense for Delinquents to take place after A&A #25, but I am not sure what the official line is.

[erwinrafael]

I think Delinquents happened after A&A #25.

[lorddunlow]

I think Delinquents happened after A&A #25.

+1

Pretty clear, IMHO.

[BugsySig]

I think Delinquents happened after A&A #25.

+1

Pretty clear, IMHO.

Same.