Is Rai 0 still relevant ???

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Post by IanAlexavier »

Even though I like the idea of a Rai 0, it really locked the creative process.. maybe it wasnt such a great idea. Or maybe it was brilliant becasue it really made the writers focus on tight continuity :thumb:

Either way, DNV will need to work it out. Whatever they say goes, they own it, not us. We will just need to decide if we will choose to support them by buying the new stories.

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Post by cjv »

IanAlexavier wrote:Even though I like the idea of a Rai 0, it really locked the creative process.. maybe it wasnt such a great idea. Or maybe it was brilliant becasue it really made the writers focus on tight continuity :thumb:

Either way, DNV will need to work it out. Whatever they say goes, they own it, not us. We will just need to decide if we will choose to support them by buying the new stories.
You could look at it two ways. It either limited the creative process - you "had" to tell the stories that were in Rai 0.

Or it encouraged it - because even though you had guidelines, you still had to be creative to tell the story in such a way that people would want to read it. In addition, if, as a writer, you wanted something to "happen" you would have to find a way to make it possible using Rai 0 as a guide.

Which is better? I don't know. Probably depends on creativity and originality of the writer. You can get back stories either way.

Chris

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Post by ncameron »

"They've done studies, you know. Eighty-one percent of the time, it works every time."


But why tie yourself into continuity from book thats almost 20 years?
That would be akin to Shooter thinking that everyone needs to know every issue of Magnus, Solar, and Turok before he started VH1. It's not necesary nor should it be.

I mean in all honesty continuity is a superboy punch/deal with the devil/destruction of the multiverse/creation of the 52/Bucky didnt really die, away from being changed.

-Neil

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Post by greg »

I'm not so much concerned that Rai #0 locked in certain events,
I'm more concerned that it didn't mention certain things.

If an event was important to the Valiant universe it was in Rai #0.

Unless a particular storyline in any Valiant title is related to a Rai #0 event,
they're basically telling us... "It's not important".

So, you're reading along in your favorite title... and it looks like the hero
is in grave danger and there's no way he'll be able to survive.
Is there suspense? Are you worried? Nope.
Rai #0 says he lives a while longer.
Whatever is happening, it's not important.

Ohhh... Chaos Effect! Oh no, Birthquake!!!
What does Rai #0 say about these extremely important books and events?
Nothing? Oh, well then they're not important.
Whatever happens, it wasn't even a "blip" on the
Valiant history radar that is Rai #0.

Rai #0 stories could be fantastically told. They would be key to the history of Valiant,
but everything else is automatically less important because
it didn't make the pages of Rai #0.

X-O Manowar goes 68 issues... nothing important happens.
X-O Manowar will die fighting Harada... someday...
and nothing in #0 - #68 can change that.
Whatever does happen in X-O after Rai #0 was printed,
if it's not related to X-O Manowar killing Harada,
it's not important enough to be "remembered".

Rai #0 set up the important events for the Valiant universe...
and it declared everything else irrelevant.

So, Rai #0 either needs to be invalidated...
or we're going to be reading stories that:
A) Aren't important enough to be mentioned in Rai #0
or
B) Are important enough to be in Rai #0, but weren't mentioned.
(Which seems to invalidate Rai #0's purpose.)

Neither of those are very good options.

In fact, we've already seen A)... it was called post-Unity.
Except for 9 stories (out of 600 comics), everything that happened
(in those 600 comics) was unimportant to the history of Valiant.

Someone wants to say 9 out of 11 is a powerful statement about Rai #0.

I say 9 out of 600 is a more powerful statement that Rai #0 killed Valiant.

Pre-Unity Valiant... ANYTHING could happen. Major heroes could die at any time.
Major events could shift the foundation of the universe at ANY time.

Post-Unity Valiant... NOTHING IMPORTANT could happen, unless it was already in Rai #0.
Major heroes could die... at the appropriate time only.
Major events could only happen if they were mentioned in Rai #0.
If something LOOKED like a major event, but wasn't mentioned in Rai #0,
then there's no suspense... no uncertainty... no anxious moments...
we know it will turn into a minor event unworthy to be mentioned.
(So why am I reading this? No reason to read it... and by 1996, Valiant was dead.)

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Post by mavros »

Never really thought of Rai #0 like that before.

Kinda makes it like a Superman story (well, 99.9999% of the time)... you know he's not in any mortal danger and he will not die himself. The only drama is in whether the supporting cast will survive.

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Post by greg »

mavros wrote:Never really thought of Rai #0 like that before.

Kinda makes it like a Superman story (well, 99.9999% of the time)... you know he's not in any mortal danger and he will not die himself. The only drama is in whether the supporting cast will survive.
If there was a Rai #0 that was absolute truth in the D.C. universe,
you wouldn't even be worried about the supporting cast.

No reason to worry (or buy the comic) at all. :|

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

So Rai #0 killed VALIANT?

:roll:

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Post by Cyberstrike »

Continuity.

Not my favorite word and definitely not my favorite concept. I've said it before and I'll say it again, rigid continuity strangles creativity. Actually, the word "rigid" is redundant. Continuity is, by its very nature, rigid. Were it not, it would be called consistency and I have no problem with consistency.

Consistency dictates that a character behave in a manner consistent with his or her history, personality, whatever as established. Superman doesn't act like Batman doesn't act like the Hulk and so on and so forth.

Continuity dictates that a character come equipped with a datebook so his or her whereabouts on any given day can be determined then doggedly adhered to, that any and all events told must be aligned just so. If “Action Comics” Superman was shown to be in Metropolis on Wednesday, then how is it he's show to be on Rann in the “Superman” book? Continuity demands that be dealt with.

Consistency dictates that a character's previous appearances be acknowledged within the context of the individual title. Mirror Master was turned to glass? Pick him up from there and run with it.

Continuity demands that a character's previous appearances fit into an overall, rigid timeline. How long was Mirror Master glass? What events passed during that period? How can he appear in the Flash after being glass for a month when Green Lantern's had only a week's worth of adventures during the same period? Continuity demands I read every DC book that arrives in my comp package (even the Rucka stuff! ) because God forbid I set a story in Cleveland and not acknowledge the fact that Geoff's got the JSA tearing up a section of the city that month.

Honestly... Does anybody really care?

I know an argument can be made that continuity and consistency are basically different words for the same thing, that I'm splitting hairs here, but that's not the way I see it and it's my column so back off!

Not convinced? How about this?

Consistency doesn't force perpetual reboots of long standing characters so that, in some cases, fifty plus years of stories can be crowbar jammed into the character's perceived timeline.

Continuity does. Spider-Man can't be that young! He's been around since the sixties!

Give me a break.

Galactus almost wiped out all life on Earth and only the Fantastic Four showed up even though the event took place in midtown Manhattan, home to any of dozens of other Marvel heroes. A great story considered a near classic. I shudder to think how the story might have played out had continuity reared it's ugly head. Let's see now -- Thor's in the Bronx so he'd... Spider-Man's in midtown fighting the Vulture so he'd have to... Avengers mansion's in midtown so they'd... AAGH!

Actually, I'm a little surprised no one's gone back and done a continuity retcon explaining where everyone was when Galactus came calling. You know, the kind of fill in the blanks, masturbatory nonsense that sometimes passes for storytelling nowadays.

And before you start in, yes, I've been guilty of a few of those "gems" myself. In 20/20 hindsight, not something I'm proud of.

Short form... Okay, maybe not so short but you've read this far... Continuity binds. I can't begin to count how many times I've heard of great story ideas that were squelched in the name of continuity.

And didn't continuity used to be the stuff of fandom? Wasn't it originally a creative exercise by hardcore fans to see it events could or couldn't be aligned, done solely for entertainment purposes? How'd it bleed over to the actual product? Was it fans turned pro showing up for work with the accumulated luggage of their individual obsessions? An aging reader base that insisted the characters grow old with them? The kind of professional laziness that plunders the past instead of enriching the future?

Don't know, don't care, don’t like continuity.

I think we were better off when matters of continuity were left to the fans, when it was just an intellectual exercise done for the hell of it. Not to mention they were so much better at it than we are.

Huh. I guess I am kinda, sorta, splitting hairs here. Still, that's the way I see it and let's always keep in mind that "opinions are like a**holes, everyone's got one".

Till next time

Keith Giffen
Griffen's new column at CBR

I got into Valiant during Unity and was amazed by it but after Rai #0 I felt that most Valiant's charm was lost. I bought most of the Valiant books and gave them a quick read and that was it.

I mean what was the point of reading Shadowman if I knew that he
would die in 1999 and there was nothing he could do change it?
The same with Harbinger, Archer & Armstrong, and X-O Manowar since we already knew the fates of most of this character they became a lot less interesting (to me at least).
I think that Greg is right Valiant shot themselves in the foot by locking themselves into a hard written continuity that was unchangeable. I also feel that many creators that might have wanted to work at Valiant (or vice versa) might have found the continuity way too tight to tell great stories that might have been told but they would have cancelled out what was stated in Rai #0.

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Post by magnusr »

greg wrote:I say 9 out of 600 is a more powerful statement that Rai #0 killed Valiant.
You've described what Rai 0 became in people's minds. But was it really more than a Geomancer telling a very narrow part of history, as he thought was appropriate for the situation?

/Magnus

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Post by greg »

ManofTheAtom wrote:So Rai #0 killed VALIANT?

:roll:
If you believe Rai #0, and you are reading a story after Rai #0,
do you have ANY doubt that the events in that story will either
match Rai #0 (which you already knew), or they will be so
unimportant that they don't deserve mentioning in Rai #0
(which you already knew)?

If you already know it, you don't pay $2.50 for it... every month...
for ten titles... for four years.

Somewhere in there, you give up.

Valiant in 1996 was a company where the readers had given up.

What had changed between pre-Unity and post-Unity?

Excitement. Mystery. Possibility. Creativity. Inevitability.

Rai #0 is box with only little oxygen... four years later, Valiant had suffocated.

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

greg wrote:
ManofTheAtom wrote:So Rai #0 killed VALIANT?

:roll:
If you believe Rai #0, and you are reading a story after Rai #0,
do you have ANY doubt that the events in that story will either
match Rai #0 (which you already knew), or they will be so
unimportant that they don't deserve mentioning in Rai #0
(which you already knew)?

If you already know it, you don't pay $2.50 for it... every month...
for ten titles... for four years.

Somewhere in there, you give up.

Valiant in 1996 was a company where the readers had given up.

What had changed between pre-Unity and post-Unity?

Excitement. Mystery. Possibility. Creativity. Inevitability.

Rai #0 is box with only little oxygen... four years later, Valiant had suffocated.
And according to you it was knowing how the story would end that caused the cancelation of the titles. The declining quality of the stories had nothing to do with it?

The painter who burned homeles people in XO didn't cause the series to be canceled, it was knowing that 70 years in the future Aric would die.

:roll:

Just to add more details to that.

It was knowing that Aric, who at the time would be chronologically almost 100 years old, would die fighting Harada that caused the series to be canceled?

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

Whine, whine, whine, whine

Keith Giffen
Isn't Giffen the idiot who came up with the XO bike?

Is that the kind of freedom that ignoring continuity you want to see expressed?

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Post by greg »

ManofTheAtom wrote:
greg wrote:
ManofTheAtom wrote:So Rai #0 killed VALIANT?

:roll:
If you believe Rai #0, and you are reading a story after Rai #0,
do you have ANY doubt that the events in that story will either
match Rai #0 (which you already knew), or they will be so
unimportant that they don't deserve mentioning in Rai #0
(which you already knew)?

If you already know it, you don't pay $2.50 for it... every month...
for ten titles... for four years.

Somewhere in there, you give up.

Valiant in 1996 was a company where the readers had given up.

What had changed between pre-Unity and post-Unity?

Excitement. Mystery. Possibility. Creativity. Inevitability.

Rai #0 is box with only little oxygen... four years later, Valiant had suffocated.
And according to you it was knowing how the story would end that caused the cancelation of the titles. The declining quality of the stories had nothing to do with it?

The painter who burned homeles people in XO didn't cause the series to be canceled, it was knowing that 70 years in the future Aric would die.

:roll:

Just to add more details to that.

It was knowing that Aric, who at the time would be chronologically almost 100 years old, would die fighting Harada that caused the series to be canceled?
What battle could Aric, the barbarian in the universe's most fantastic armor,
have that would be exciting, thrilling, dangerous, mysterious, etc., when
we know he lives to be 100?

Do you think readers of Cerebus INCREASED during the #200 issues
when they knew the series wasn't going to end until #300?

Nope. They left. They returned when it got close to #300.

X-O Manowar became unimportant until Aric gets close to age 100.

That's a long time to publish books with no meaning and expect people to buy them.

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

greg wrote:What battle could Aric, the barbarian in the universe's most fantastic armor,
have that would be exciting, thrilling, dangerous, mysterious, etc., when
we know he lives to be 100?

Do you think readers of Cerebus INCREASED during the #200 issues
when they knew the series wasn't going to end until #300?

Nope. They left. They returned when it got close to #300.

X-O Manowar became unimportant until Aric gets close to age 100.

That's a long time to publish books with no meaning and expect people to buy them.
How does that old cliche go?

"I can't kill you, but you're gonna wish I could".

That basically means that while someone cannot die, it doesn't mean they cannot suffer.

The question is not "will Aric die during this particular battle?", but "how will Aric survive this particular battle?"

It's kindda like watching an action movie (let' say Indiana Jones).

Do we really think that the boulder will crush him five minutes into the movie?

Do we really think that he's going to burn when the Nazis open the ark of the covenant? No, of course not. When you watch an action movie you go in with certain preconceptions, one of which is that the hero will not die.

Does that mean that you don't get chills from watching him suffer?

Oh no, in Temple of Doom Indiana became evil!! How will he ever get back to normal?!?

Notice how I question HOW Indiana will get back to normal. I have no doubt whatsoever that, by the time the movie is over, Indiana Jones will be a good guy again.

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Post by greg »

ManofTheAtom wrote:
greg wrote:What battle could Aric, the barbarian in the universe's most fantastic armor,
have that would be exciting, thrilling, dangerous, mysterious, etc., when
we know he lives to be 100?

Do you think readers of Cerebus INCREASED during the #200 issues
when they knew the series wasn't going to end until #300?

Nope. They left. They returned when it got close to #300.

X-O Manowar became unimportant until Aric gets close to age 100.

That's a long time to publish books with no meaning and expect people to buy them.
How does that old cliche go?

"I can't kill you, but you're gonna wish I could".

That basically means that while someone cannot die, it doesn't mean they cannot suffer.

The question is not "will Aric die during this particular battle?", but "how will Aric survive this particular battle?"

It's kindda like watching an action movie (let' say Indiana Jones).

Do we really think that the boulder will crush him five minutes into the movie?

Do we really think that he's going to burn when the Nazis open the ark of the covenant? No, of course not. When you watch an action movie you go in with certain preconceptions, one of which is that the hero will not die.

Does that mean that you don't get chills from watching him suffer?

Oh no, in Temple of Doom Indiana became evil!! How will he ever get back to normal?!?

Notice how I question HOW Indiana will get back to normal. I have no doubt whatsoever that, by the time the movie is over, Indiana Jones will be a good guy again.
You spend (the equivalent of) $30 to watch three Indiana Jones movies.

You spend $30 on X-O Manowar books on the shelf and you're only up to issue #12.

Indiana Jones was extrememly successful, and they knew where to stop.
(20 years later, they even know they can start again.)

X-O Manowar was moderately successful, and they didn't know where to stop.
What did that get us? A bike, a virtual reality insane chick, and a "it never happened" ending.

Yeah, let me keep spending my money on that.

P.S. Is Aric 100 years old yet?

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

greg wrote:
ManofTheAtom wrote:
greg wrote:What battle could Aric, the barbarian in the universe's most fantastic armor,
have that would be exciting, thrilling, dangerous, mysterious, etc., when
we know he lives to be 100?

Do you think readers of Cerebus INCREASED during the #200 issues
when they knew the series wasn't going to end until #300?

Nope. They left. They returned when it got close to #300.

X-O Manowar became unimportant until Aric gets close to age 100.

That's a long time to publish books with no meaning and expect people to buy them.
How does that old cliche go?

"I can't kill you, but you're gonna wish I could".

That basically means that while someone cannot die, it doesn't mean they cannot suffer.

The question is not "will Aric die during this particular battle?", but "how will Aric survive this particular battle?"

It's kindda like watching an action movie (let' say Indiana Jones).

Do we really think that the boulder will crush him five minutes into the movie?

Do we really think that he's going to burn when the Nazis open the ark of the covenant? No, of course not. When you watch an action movie you go in with certain preconceptions, one of which is that the hero will not die.

Does that mean that you don't get chills from watching him suffer?

Oh no, in Temple of Doom Indiana became evil!! How will he ever get back to normal?!?

Notice how I question HOW Indiana will get back to normal. I have no doubt whatsoever that, by the time the movie is over, Indiana Jones will be a good guy again.
You spend (the equivalent of) $30 to watch three Indiana Jones movies.

You spend $30 on X-O Manowar books on the shelf and you're only up to issue #12.

Indiana Jones was extrememly successful, and they knew where to stop.
(20 years later, they even know they can start again.)

X-O Manowar was moderately successful, and they didn't know where to stop.
What did that get us? A bike, a virtual reality insane chick, and a "it never happened" ending.

Yeah, let me keep spending my money on that.

P.S. Is Aric 100 years old yet?
Are you complaining about the content or the cost?

The trick is to keep people interested between the beginning and the end of the story, regardles of them knowing the ending before hand.

If the stories sucked, then people will stop buying the series no matter how it's supposed to end.

The things you list did not happen as a result of Aric's death fighting Harada. One thing had nothing to do with the other. Those things happened due to incompetent writers who had no clue of what they were doing. they did not know how to keep people interested and did not know how to write good stories.

What you're argueing is "well, if they were free to kill him, then they could tell a good story", which makes no sense. Being able to kill the character doesn't automatically mean that you're going to tell a good story unless you actually kill him.

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Post by siren3-4 »

No matter how you "know" in your head that they will never kill off the hero . . there is still that 1 percent chance that just maybe the company will do something crazy . . .

Rai 0 took that away . . and what you got was stories like "Let's kill the X-O armor" and then we just happen to replace it . . . they made their job more difficult and it took away that 1 percent that is so important to keep the suspense . . .

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

siren3-4 wrote:No matter how you "know" in your head that they will never kill off the hero . . there is still that 1 percent chance that just maybe the company will do something crazy . . .

Rai 0 took that away . . and what you got was stories like "Let's kill the X-O armor" and then we just happen to replace it . . . they made their job more difficult and it took away that 1 percent that is so important to keep the suspense . . .
This is like discussing the Superman marriage with fans who want Superman to "play the field".

They think that Superman being able to date will make the stories better, yet have no basis for it.

Where's the basis to say that being able to kill the character will automatically make the stories better?

How many VALIANT characters were not in Rai #0 and their series were canceled because the stories sucked?

Did being free to kill Ninjak make the stories better?

Did being free to kill Magnus make the stories better?

Did being free to kill Rai make the stories better?

Takao's final fate (that Magnus broke his neck) was not covered in Rai #0. Does that mean that you think that his 12 issues as Rai are better than X-O Manowar's 60 issues that were published after Rai #0?

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Post by siren3-4 »

ManofTheAtom wrote:
siren3-4 wrote:No matter how you "know" in your head that they will never kill off the hero . . there is still that 1 percent chance that just maybe the company will do something crazy . . .

Rai 0 took that away . . and what you got was stories like "Let's kill the X-O armor" and then we just happen to replace it . . . they made their job more difficult and it took away that 1 percent that is so important to keep the suspense . . .
This is like discussing the Superman marriage with fans who want Superman to "play the field".

They think that Superman being able to date will make the stories better, yet have no basis for it.

Where's the basis to say that being able to kill the character will automatically make the stories better?
That's not what I'm saying . . .

Movies can start at the end and then show you how you arrived there as long as the story is good . . .

A soap (which is basically what a comic is) can't do that. If they came out with a book that said "for the next 30 years here is what is going to happen on Day's of our Lives . . . becky will marry and divorce 10 times . . John will be in a coma for 10 years then show up at one of Becky's marriages and shoot her husband to be Phil . . . Jennine will have a black baby who will become president but will then be assinated by Phil's illigimate son Fred . . ."

That soap would die . . . It takes away part of the reason to watch . . .

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

siren3-4 wrote:A soap (which is basically what a comic is) can't do that. If they came out with a book that said "for the next 30 years here is what is going to happen on Day's of our Lives . . . becky will marry and divorce 10 times . . John will be in a coma for 10 years then show up at one of Becky's marriages and shoot her husband to be Phil . . . Jennine will have a black baby who will become president but will then be assinated by Phil's illigimate son Fred . . .".
That's not what Rai #0 did.

Rai #0 did not give out a play-by-play of what would happen for 30 or 70 years. It told you how the characters were going to die, that's all.

It told you that, unlike DC and Marvel, VALIANT had no problem killing their characters, and it showed you how they were going to die, as heroes.

Jack died riding the world of the Darque power

A heroic demise.

Archer died saving Aram from Harada.

A heroic demise.

Bloodshot died defending the moonbase from Ax.

A heroic demise.

Aric died fighting Harada.

A heroic demise.

This is akin to watching Return of the Jedi 15 years before watching Phantom Menace.

You already know that the kid, Anakin, is going to die a heroic death saving his son from the Emperor.

You already know that the kid, Anakin, is going to be corrupted by the dark side of the Force.

You're not watching Phantom Menace, Attack of the Clones, or Revenge of the Sith to find out WHAT is going to happen, you're watching to find out HOW it happened.

Expanding it to other characters.

You already know that Obi Wan becomes a hermit in Tatooine.

You already know that Vader kills him.

You already know that Amidala gives birth to Luke and Leia.

You already know that Luke and Leia will be split up after they're born.

You already know a lot of what is going to happen, but what you don't know is HOW it's going to happen.

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Drift
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Post by Drift »

We've done this one.

Shadowman died ridding the world of Darque power.

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siren3-4
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Post by siren3-4 »

ManofTheAtom wrote:
siren3-4 wrote:A soap (which is basically what a comic is) can't do that. If they came out with a book that said "for the next 30 years here is what is going to happen on Day's of our Lives . . . becky will marry and divorce 10 times . . John will be in a coma for 10 years then show up at one of Becky's marriages and shoot her husband to be Phil . . . Jennine will have a black baby who will become president but will then be assinated by Phil's illigimate son Fred . . .".
That's not what Rai #0 did.

Rai #0 did not give out a play-by-play of what would happen for 30 or 70 years. It told you how the characters were going to die, that's all.
If that were true the comic would have been 3 pages long . . . it got about as detailed as my example above in a lot of instances . . .

This is akin to watching Return of the Jedi 15 years before watching Phantom Menace.

You already know that the kid, Anakin, is going to die a heroic death saving his son from the Emperor.

You already know that the kid, Anakin, is going to be corrupted by the dark side of the Force.

You're not watching Phantom Menace, Attack of the Clones, or Revenge of the Sith to find out WHAT is going to happen, you're watching to find out HOW it happened.
Prequels for the most part are a bad idea . . . It only works for very well loved concepts and characters . . . Rai 0 is more like knowing Vader is Luke's father before seeing Empire . . . or knowing Yoda dies . . or being told ahead of time that Jabba is thrown into the pit . . .

Valiant is not Marvel or DC . . they don't have characters that have been loved for decades that they can go back and show a prequel . . instead they decided to make their whole universe a prequel . . .

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

If that were true the comic would have been 3 pages long . . . it got about as detailed as my example above in a lot of instances . . .
Not really. It covered deaths and small events, like Faith leading the resistance and Kris writing a letter.

There are still many details to fill out in those two.
Prequels for the most part are a bad idea . . . It only works for very well loved concepts and characters . . . Rai 0 is more like knowing Vader is Luke's father before seeing Empire . . . or knowing Yoda dies . . or being told ahead of time that Jabba is thrown into the pit . . .

Valiant is not Marvel or DC . . they don't have characters that have been loved for decades that they can go back and show a prequel . . instead they decided to make their whole universe a prequel . . .
They did when their first comic was Magnus, which meant that their present was the 41st Century and the then-present day comics were their past.

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Post by siren3-4 »

ManofTheAtom wrote:
If that were true the comic would have been 3 pages long . . . it got about as detailed as my example above in a lot of instances . . .
Not really. It covered deaths and small events, like Faith leading the resistance and Kris writing a letter.

There are still many details to fill out in those two.
Prequels for the most part are a bad idea . . . It only works for very well loved concepts and characters . . . Rai 0 is more like knowing Vader is Luke's father before seeing Empire . . . or knowing Yoda dies . . or being told ahead of time that Jabba is thrown into the pit . . .

Valiant is not Marvel or DC . . they don't have characters that have been loved for decades that they can go back and show a prequel . . instead they decided to make their whole universe a prequel . . .
They did when their first comic was Magnus, which meant that their present was the 41st Century and the then-present day comics were their past.

That's a 2000 year difference . . . not a single generation . . .

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Post by ManofTheAtom »

siren3-4 wrote:
ManofTheAtom wrote:
If that were true the comic would have been 3 pages long . . . it got about as detailed as my example above in a lot of instances . . .
Not really. It covered deaths and small events, like Faith leading the resistance and Kris writing a letter.

There are still many details to fill out in those two.
Prequels for the most part are a bad idea . . . It only works for very well loved concepts and characters . . . Rai 0 is more like knowing Vader is Luke's father before seeing Empire . . . or knowing Yoda dies . . or being told ahead of time that Jabba is thrown into the pit . . .

Valiant is not Marvel or DC . . they don't have characters that have been loved for decades that they can go back and show a prequel . . instead they decided to make their whole universe a prequel . . .
They did when their first comic was Magnus, which meant that their present was the 41st Century and the then-present day comics were their past.

That's a 2000 year difference . . . not a single generation . . .
So?

Just because you knew how the characters were going to end it did not mean that the stories had to be crap.

Aric's death was not responsible for the painter who burnt homeless people or the xo bike. Those came out of (apparently) Keith Giffen's head, as we just saw, he didn't much care for continuity.


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