What comics do you CGC?

[whetteon]

You not only get the nifty holder, but ASSURANCE. You're BUYING assurance that the book is, according to the community, fairly and accurately graded, and that MOST other people will accept it as such. And, as such, you're buying an intangible that means just as much as the tangible.

See, I have a problem with this line right here. What your saying is "niffty package = $$". I don't care how you word it; it breaks down to that simple fact. I'm sure it's pretty obvious to all of us here that if I bought 5 copies of Spawn #1 at CGC graded 10.0 for $200 a piece and cracked open the case on 3 of those, 2 would sale for around $200 (or whatever the amazingly high price is these days) and the rest would be $7. So you ARE PAYING for the plastic holder. What the holder means can be interpreted but don't confuse yourself that a truly NM comic is going to get anything near what a cgc one is in these current wacky market trends.

Now, I'm not complaining that this is or is not fair to all parties involved; but what I AM saying is that this whole CGC trend has become a speculative sport much like buying "multiple copies " was in the early 90's. Not so much for the older comics since they can never be replaced, but for the CURRENT books that are hitting the market NOW. The current issues is where people are trying to make the quick $$ just like the 90's.

And if history has taught us anything, once people start trying to trade their Spawn #1's for the prices they bought it at and they realize no one wants it, there is going to be a huge dumping of the market along with a max exodus of collectors tired of the whole thing. Look at the stock market during the internet for an example of herd mentality and ridiculous one year returns.

Why is there whole new terms to buying comics, cgc'ing them and then selling them for premium dollars? "Flipping" comes to mind but I think it's the other term.

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

See, I have a problem with this line right here. What your saying is "niffty package = $$".

No, I'm not. I'm saying that the MARKET has said that "nifty package + high number = $$". You can argue with ME all day long, and probably make a good case....

But you cannot argue with the market.

I don't care how you word it; it breaks down to that simple fact. I'm sure it's pretty obvious to all of us here that if I bought 5 copies of Spawn #1 at CGC graded 10.0 for $200 a piece and cracked open the case on 3 of those, 2 would sale for around $200 (or whatever the amazingly high price is these days) and the rest would be $7. So you ARE PAYING for the plastic holder.

No, you're not. The nifty plastic case is still there. What you've done is removed the INTANGIBLE, the assurance by CGC that the book is in the grade they say it is. Once the case is opened, anything goes, and you have a raw book again, as well as a nifty plastic case. The case isn't worth much more than the Overall Fee - the Actual Grading Fee.

What the holder means can be interpreted but don't confuse yourself that a truly NM comic is going to get anything near what a cgc one is in these current wacky market trends.

Who's confused? No one, least of all me, has said that raw books will get CGC prices, and, in fact, that's my entire point.

Again...it's the ASSURANCE people are buying, not the nifty plastic case. The nifty plastic case is merely the VESSEL, the MEDIUM if you will, that represents that assurance.

Again...YOU ARE NOT paying for a 'nifty case'. You're paying for (ostensibly) professional assurance, as I've said from the start.

but what I AM saying is that this whole CGC trend has become a speculative sport much like buying "multiple copies " was in the early 90's.

I already explained why the two are totally and utterly different, and cannot be compared other than in the broadest and most general sense, in that they are both speculative. Time will see who is proved correct.

Not so much for the older comics since they can never be replaced, but for the CURRENT books that are hitting the market NOW. The current issues is where people are trying to make the quick $$ just like the 90's.

Again....the first two books in the Wizard First series failed to net a single 10.0. How many books were involved? Surely several hundred, if not thousands.

Not a single 10.0....

Which is as it SHOULD be.

And is ALSO why 10.0 books sell for crazy money.

And if history has taught us anything, once people start trying to trade their Spawn #1's for the prices they bought it at and they realize no one wants it, there is going to be a huge dumping of the market along with a max exodus of collectors tired of the whole thing. Look at the stock market during the internet for an example of herd mentality and ridiculous one year returns.

You boys are simply not understanding how rare these books really are. What can I do to convince you that 9.9 and 10.0 books are INCREDIBLY rare, REGARDLESS of which book? Do I need to pull up census figures? Unless a massive find of Spawn #1's turn up 9.9 and 10.0, the books simply WILL NOT go down in value. The fact that they are Spawn #1 is secondary to the grade. A 9.9 is a 9.9 is a 9.9. There are, after 4+ years, STILL only 53 books at 9.9, and only SIX at 10.0...and this is a book that EVERYONE SAVED, from DAY 1!. Do you REALLY think people haven't TRIED to get those grades? Of COURSE they have! They simply don't EXIST! We're talking 4%, of the BEST books submitted, and that's a PHENOMENAL percentage in these grades.

History has taught us nothing, as there's been nothing in comics's history that can be compared to this. Apples to oranges, gents, apples to oranges.

And for those looking to make an example of COINS....when the market crashed in 1989, it crashed on MS65 and LOWER grades. Grades from MS66 and up not only DID NOT crash, they BARELY dipped, and have since seen INCREDIBLE gains.

Bottom line: people will pay for the very best, period. That's never going to change, no matter how ridiculous some may think it is.

Why is there whole new terms to buying comics, cgc'ing them and then selling them for premium dollars? "Flipping" comes to mind but I think it's the other term.

You think you can pick up a stack of comics from your LCS and pull out a 10.0? The truth is, it takes an INCREDIBLE amount of work AND luck to find a single 10.0. They just don't exist, by the nature of the books.

It just doesn't happen, which is PRECISELY why they are worth so much.

See?

[greg]

Going more directly back to the original discussion...

Here are the Valiant books I would consider sending to CGC
if I was reasonably sure that I would receive 9.6 or higher...
(...in order of personal preference)

Harbinger 1 with coupon (I would accept 9.4 or higher for this one)
Unity 0 Red
Harbinger 0 Pink
Chaos Effect Alpha Red
Solar 10 (first print)
Magnus 12
Magnus 0 (either version)
Rai 3 (preferably centered)
Rai 4
Predator vs. Magnus Trade Paperback (64 pages)
Armorines 0 Stand Alone (Timewalker ad on back)
Magnus 1 (with cards/coupon)
Solar 1
X-O Manowar 1
X-O Manowar 4

Any absolutely pristine copies of the following... (possible 9.8 or higher)
Harbinger 2 through 6 (with coupon)
Magnus 5, 6 (with cards/coupon)
Solar 2 through 9
X-O 2, 3, 5, 6
Rai 1, 2, 5
Shadowman 1

Gold and Platinum books I would consider... preferably 9.8 or higher...
(in order of personal preference)
Eternal Warrior 1 Gold Embossed
Archer & Armstrong 0 Gold
X-O Manowar 1/2 Gold
Eternal Warrior 1 Gold Flat
Magnus 21 Gold
X-O Manowar 0 Gold
Chaos Effect Omega Gold
Ninjak 1 Gold Holochrome
Bloodshot 0 Gold
Armorines 0 Gold
(...the other golds and platinums aren't high on my personal list)

[whetteon]

http://boards.collectors-society.com/sh ... 31&fpart=1

I rest my case. Thank you and drive through

[cinlach@aol.com]

i think i came off a bit too...agressive...in my previous posts.
i don't think ill of anyone who buys cgc'ed comics for these high prices, nor do i think ill of people who find books in good condition, have them graded and make a nice hefty profit on them. i mean america is based on making money...now as much as that sometimes irks me it is the cold hard reality of life.

it's just, in this humble irishmans opinion, the "intangible" part of the cgc experience (i.e. the special something that makes an slabbed book worth 200% more then a unslabbed one) is just way to intangible for me.

i also recognize that there are collectors out there to whom grade is EVERYTHING...given the opportunity to buy a trashed copy of action comics #1 for $25 bucks they'd pass beause of the condition it was in.

my slant towards collecting is that i want to be able to read it, first and foremost. if i can't read it, then there's no point in me buying it because i genuinely enjoy comics as an artform. so if i can buy a copy of giant size x-men #1 with a large rip on the back cover for $9...i do, and did. i just wanna read the damn thing, but at the same time i like owning a piece of history too.

i guess it all comes down to whatever you dig the most. so if you dig cgc'ed books, then god bless you. that just leaves the lower grade copies for me and folks like me.

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

http://boards.collectors-society.com/sh ... 31&fpart=1

I rest my case. Thank you and drive through

One nutjob is the exception that proves the rule....case unrested.