Bloodshot #0 Discussion

[Blood of Heroes]

First off... on the race issue. It is a completely legitimate question, without any racist overtones. It's the same question as "is he shooting himself with his left hand?" Its just one more element to the character. We've had this discussion before on the Marvel board about Nick Fury. Seriously, no one here says anything mean about anyone, or anything. Obviously a question like that isn't meant to be racist. And anyone who takes it as such needs to ease up a bit. It doesn't affect anyone's enjoyment of the books, it's just another question to understand as much about the character, and book as possible. Not a fan of anyone making someone feel like a *SQUEE* for asking that question.

No, it's all cool. His race was what stuck out the most to me reading it the first time and I wanted to know what other people thought. CallMeBloodshot just wanted to know what the hell happened on the last page.

[hunter_peterson]

I'm pretty sure the narration and violence post-soul-upgrade were taking place at roughly the same time and the final scen was after some time. He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Also, I can't say that what ethnicity the bleached-white meat that makes up Bloodshot is, but it's neat that he's black. Doesn't really change anything, but I suppose this is technically one less straight white guy. (Assuming he's straight, I guess... he's not acted romantic to any real human, I suppose.) neat is probably a good word for my feeling.

[Blood of Heroes]

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

[Blood of Heroes]

One more before I go to bed...

[nonplayer]

Loved this issue I read the first set of postes and decided to put in my two cents befoe continuing
The guy with no legs and arms that the nanites devoured his name was James....
The scientist is dead! Bloodshot snapped his neck and if you look at the last page theyr is streaking on the pannels to show movement have another look its quite brilliant! Great book 5/5 or 10/10 what eve.

[CallMeBloodshot]

First off... on the race issue. It is a completely legitimate question, without any racist overtones. It's the same question as "is he shooting himself with his left hand?" Its just one more element to the character. We've had this discussion before on the Marvel board about Nick Fury. Seriously, no one here says anything mean about anyone, or anything. Obviously a question like that isn't meant to be racist. And anyone who takes it as such needs to ease up a bit. It doesn't affect anyone's enjoyment of the books, it's just another question to understand as much about the character, and book as possible. Not a fan of anyone making someone feel like a *SQUEE* for asking that question.

No, it's all cool. His race was what stuck out the most to me reading it the first time and I wanted to know what other people thought. CallMeBloodshot just wanted to know what the hell happened on the last page.

Haha thanks for clearing that up yeah, I wasn't trying to insinuate anyone as being racist

[bribri]

1. I love that the book starts with "1992". It's obviously an homage to the original. Excellent awareness and nod to the legacy.
2. Sticking a gun into one's mouth and shooting through one's head to kill the guy behind is an incredible kill. It's up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with one's broken arm...
3. The image of shooting through his head is clear to me. With his right hand he reaches back and steals the gun from the other guy's holster with his right hand. The second iteration of his right hand shows the gun's profile out in front of his face. And then the third iteration of the gun shows a top view of the gun in his mouth, still holding it with his right hand. However, I see his left hand is place on top of his right hand, perhaps to hold the gun in his mouth and to avoid kick-back... Awesome.
4. Spinning the head around 360 and showing it from the dying man's perspective is right up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with a broken arm and shooting a guy in the head via one's own head...

[hunter_peterson]

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

Oops. Probably shouldn't read comics at three in the morning or else I miss obvious stuff... I'll revise my assessment after that reread. It's pretty clearly the nanites taking a new host and killing anyone who knows about that operation, just as he does for every operation he's involved in. Bloodshot appears to still be the reanimated corpses of the dead, so there HAVE been many bodies, but the nanites carry all the information. Including, now, the souls of those who die as Bloodshot, as well as the memories of dead soldiers.

So far that's only this one guy, and probably will be... but that has very, very interesting potential waaaaaaay down the line. Especially with the A&A 12 tease of Archer killing Bloodshot. If we get a NEW host for the nanites, would the current Bloodshot continue to exist and function like the Goldie Boy did? Fascinating...

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

[BugsySig]

With the revelation of multiple Bloodshot's this issue, it makes my proposed alternate ending to #13 even more feasible. If Kara had found the "hard reboot" and it was a container of Nanites, then her brother could have become the new Bloodshot...Complete with the memories and "soul" of the fallen Bloodshot. That would have been *SQUEE* crazy and connected the zero issue to the rest of the series in an even more profound way. But she got a bunch of money instead.

[Blood of Heroes]

1. I love that the book starts with "1992". It's obviously an homage to the original. Excellent awareness and nod to the legacy.
2. Sticking a gun into one's mouth and shooting through one's head to kill the guy behind is an incredible kill. It's up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with one's broken arm...
3. The image of shooting through his head is clear to me. With his right hand he reaches back and steals the gun from the other guy's holster with his right hand. The second iteration of his right hand shows the gun's profile out in front of his face. And then the third iteration of the gun shows a top view of the gun in his mouth, still holding it with his right hand. However, I see his left hand is place on top of his right hand, perhaps to hold the gun in his mouth and to avoid kick-back... Awesome.
4. Spinning the head around 360 and showing it from the dying man's perspective is right up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with a broken arm and shooting a guy in the head via one's own head...

Matt Kindt was talking about the upcoming Bloodshot 0 at the SDCC Valiant panel. He said it was tough to think up new and particularly gruesome ways for Bloodshot to kill people. I think he pulled it off.

[CallMeBloodshot]

1. I love that the book starts with "1992". It's obviously an homage to the original. Excellent awareness and nod to the legacy.
2. Sticking a gun into one's mouth and shooting through one's head to kill the guy behind is an incredible kill. It's up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with one's broken arm...
3. The image of shooting through his head is clear to me. With his right hand he reaches back and steals the gun from the other guy's holster with his right hand. The second iteration of his right hand shows the gun's profile out in front of his face. And then the third iteration of the gun shows a top view of the gun in his mouth, still holding it with his right hand. However, I see his left hand is place on top of his right hand, perhaps to hold the gun in his mouth and to avoid kick-back... Awesome.
4. Spinning the head around 360 and showing it from the dying man's perspective is right up there with stabbing a guy in the neck with a broken arm and shooting a guy in the head via one's own head...

Matt Kindt was talking about the upcoming Bloodshot 0 at the SDCC Valiant panel. He said it was tough to think up new and particularly gruesome ways for Bloodshot to kill people. I think he pulled it off.

He sure did. I hope Gage can carry the torch well from our first two writers.

But the tops for me is still Bloodshot stabbing someone with a protruding bone from his broken arm. Duane Swierczynski all the way haha

[CallMeBloodshot]

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

Oops. Probably shouldn't read comics at three in the morning or else I miss obvious stuff... I'll revise my assessment after that reread. It's pretty clearly the nanites taking a new host and killing anyone who knows about that operation, just as he does for every operation he's involved in. Bloodshot appears to still be the reanimated corpses of the dead, so there HAVE been many bodies, but the nanites carry all the information. Including, now, the souls of those who die as Bloodshot, as well as the memories of dead soldiers.

So far that's only this one guy, and probably will be... but that has very, very interesting potential waaaaaaay down the line. Especially with the A&A 12 tease of Archer killing Bloodshot. If we get a NEW host for the nanites, would the current Bloodshot continue to exist and function like the Goldie Boy did? Fascinating...

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

I actually don't read A&A so what's this about Archer potentially killing Bloodshot? How is that even possible haha

[hunter_peterson]

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

Oops. Probably shouldn't read comics at three in the morning or else I miss obvious stuff... I'll revise my assessment after that reread. It's pretty clearly the nanites taking a new host and killing anyone who knows about that operation, just as he does for every operation he's involved in. Bloodshot appears to still be the reanimated corpses of the dead, so there HAVE been many bodies, but the nanites carry all the information. Including, now, the souls of those who die as Bloodshot, as well as the memories of dead soldiers.

So far that's only this one guy, and probably will be... but that has very, very interesting potential waaaaaaay down the line. Especially with the A&A 12 tease of Archer killing Bloodshot. If we get a NEW host for the nanites, would the current Bloodshot continue to exist and function like the Goldie Boy did? Fascinating...

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

I actually don't read A&A so what's this about Archer potentially killing Bloodshot? How is that even possible haha

I KNOW, RIGHT?!

But yeah, in that issue Timewalker made his most proper appearance yet and laid hints like the goose laid golden eggs... many, many, many valuable nuggets. He asks Archer if he's "destroyed Bloodshot yet." Considering that he's getting closer and closer to PRS, that's a very exciting tease, to say the least. And "destroy" doesn't mean kill if Bloodshot's consciousness is in the nanites... so what DOES that mean?

In a way, it makes sense, though; if anyone knew any way to hurt Bloodshot, Archer knows all of them.

[Keith]

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

Oops. Probably shouldn't read comics at three in the morning or else I miss obvious stuff... I'll revise my assessment after that reread. It's pretty clearly the nanites taking a new host and killing anyone who knows about that operation, just as he does for every operation he's involved in. Bloodshot appears to still be the reanimated corpses of the dead, so there HAVE been many bodies, but the nanites carry all the information. Including, now, the souls of those who die as Bloodshot, as well as the memories of dead soldiers.

So far that's only this one guy, and probably will be... but that has very, very interesting potential waaaaaaay down the line. Especially with the A&A 12 tease of Archer killing Bloodshot. If we get a NEW host for the nanites, would the current Bloodshot continue to exist and function like the Goldie Boy did? Fascinating...

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

I actually don't read A&A so what's this about Archer potentially killing Bloodshot? How is that even possible haha

Perhaps it's time you start!

[Phoenix8008]

This all sounds too awesome. Can't wait to get my hands on this issue to read it!

[CallMeBloodshot]

This all sounds too awesome. Can't wait to get my hands on this issue to read it!

Dude how can you read spoilers before checking out the issue? I avoid them like he plague.

[lorddunlow]

With this issue, Bloodshot has officially surpassed Harbinger to become my favorite VEI title. I am even more nervous for the next issue with the new creative team. Think we can convince VEI to just let Kindt write it? I had never read any of his previous work - I may have to check out Mind MGMT and some of his other work.

I have lots of input, thoughts, theories, and responses to the comments made here, but I'll have to get to it in a little bit. I'm a little busy at work. I'll also be re-reading tonight (I read it quickly this morning while feeding my son breakfast before I took off for work - this issue was very odd juxtaposed against Curious George).

I was afraid of learning too much, as the mystique is what draws me into this book, but Kindt managed to reveal quite a bit while creating more questions than it answered. Awesome!

[dmezynski]

I really liked this issue. The background really offers a lot of story possibilities.

[Paradigm38]

Written insanely well (leaving more questions out there) , BEST KILL EVER (so far?) and the art top notch. Great job Valiant Get it, read it. GO!

[Phoenix8008]

This all sounds too awesome. Can't wait to get my hands on this issue to read it!

Dude how can you read spoilers before checking out the issue? I avoid them like he plague.

Because up until next month, I've been a month behind getting any issues. So if I read the spoilers right after the book comes out, I've mostly forgotten about them by the time I get the actual issue in my hands. Starting in September, I'll be able to start picking them up weekly from the LCS I just found. Sometimes reading the spoilers gives me a little more detail that (if I remember it) may be a chance to notice something on the first read that might have been missed otherwise.

[lorddunlow]

I got a little break, so I'll post some of my responses now:

Why does anyone even care about his ethnicity or race. And anyway why couldn't he be black? The guy is made up of several people, he's all of them really.

Anyway, does anyone have anything to say about the ending? I'm interested to here some opinions on that.

It's not that I care what his race is, I want to know why it seems to have changed.
Is the Bloodshot we see at the end of the book the same man/body that we just saw puke nanites into Harada's mouth? If it's a different guy, how many have there been? What happened to the last guy or the one before that? He is seemingly indestructible, so what gives?

I'm not complaining about him being black. Give me a break.

I'm not saying your racist I just think asking that question misses the point of the story. It's ambiguous as to what human body became Bloodshot, as its not really important. The body is the host of all these memories, and maybe even the "soul" of another man if you're into that kind of thing.

I may be missing the point, that is true. I was just pointing out that in all the previous books every false memory we were shown depicted him as a white guy. In this issue he is only shown as black. I just want to know why.

Maybe I'm not grasping the overall concept of Bloodshot this time around. Originally he was one guy. This time it doesn't seem like that's the case.

So in response to what you guys are talking about I had this thought - the doctor keeps referring to Bloodshot as "he". Never, not even once, does he say "they" or "it". That is really interesting considering that we have been debating his identity. This issue clearly shows that multiple (often already dead) people have been host to the nanites, and have been called "Bloodshot". However, the doctor says that he was hired to "fix the most technologically advanced project", and the general speaks in the singular as well when he asks, "has he grown his conscience?" This leads me to believe that "Bloodshot" is in fact, not a man at all, but the nanites which managed to gain sentience. I think the Grey Goo was actually an out-of-control batch of non-sentient nanites.

The nanites merely use the bodies as a template. The current iteration of Bloodshot is now different from all of the others, though, due to what Rees has done. Not only did he use the body as a template, but by programming the nanites to consume the mind/soul before death, he has given a sentient machine a soul. I think this is what has lead (in addition to the meddling by Kuretich - isn't that convenient?) to him being able to fight his programming and orders to become a "freewill" - and I think this is VEI's intentional introduction of that VH1 concept into the new universe. I have been wondering if Bloodshot was ever actually "a real boy", but in my opinion this issue states that he is not, nor has he ever been a human being - he is merely a collection of organic machines which has replicated a human - very, very closely in his current form.

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

I think you're right Blood, but I think he was writing the last part just before he was killed, while the General was in the room. If you look, the doctor is writing while talking to the General - at least in the initial coversation.

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

I really hope we do get some more of the general in the upcoming arcs. It seems like he's the one pulling all of the strings.

Incredible issue, and very horrific to mull over. A soul trapped in Bloodshot is a very interesting and horrific concept. It certainly brings a lot of questions about nuture vs. nature vs. spirituality in play without being too heavy handed with any once concept. It's vague enough to open a discussion, but without taking any definitive stances for the reader. I like that it leaves room for discussion and consideration without spelling everything out.

I love the over the top violence that has become a staple in this series; Bloodshot shooting himself through the head to kill someone standing behind him was gorgasmic. Best comic on the stands.

+1 (gorgasmic may be my new favorite word!)

I really liked this issue, and Bloodshot is (IMHO) the most interesting character in the VEI universe. I definitely see him as the bridge between the modern day and a future VEI timeline (if they do it ). I can't wait to see how they tie Rai into it.

As far as the Ivar reveal that Archer will "destroy Bloodshot", I think that lends even more creedence to my theory that Bloodshot is a machine - he doesn't kill him, but destroys him. I also think this "destruction" may lead to the creation of Rai. Maybe Archer (many years in the future - fully realizing and mastering his abilities) hacks Bloodshot and transforms him into Rai!

August 2013 will be remembered as a turning point for VEI just like Unity was in the 90s. It's subtle this time. This month has been great for me as far as my Image and Marvel books are concerned as well. I am in comic Nirvana!

[CallMeBloodshot]

I got a little break, so I'll post some of my responses now:

Why does anyone even care about his ethnicity or race. And anyway why couldn't he be black? The guy is made up of several people, he's all of them really.

Anyway, does anyone have anything to say about the ending? I'm interested to here some opinions on that.

It's not that I care what his race is, I want to know why it seems to have changed.
Is the Bloodshot we see at the end of the book the same man/body that we just saw puke nanites into Harada's mouth? If it's a different guy, how many have there been? What happened to the last guy or the one before that? He is seemingly indestructible, so what gives?

I'm not complaining about him being black. Give me a break.

I'm not saying your racist I just think asking that question misses the point of the story. It's ambiguous as to what human body became Bloodshot, as its not really important. The body is the host of all these memories, and maybe even the "soul" of another man if you're into that kind of thing.

I may be missing the point, that is true. I was just pointing out that in all the previous books every false memory we were shown depicted him as a white guy. In this issue he is only shown as black. I just want to know why.

Maybe I'm not grasping the overall concept of Bloodshot this time around. Originally he was one guy. This time it doesn't seem like that's the case.

So in response to what you guys are talking about I had this thought - the doctor keeps referring to Bloodshot as "he". Never, not even once, does he say "they" or "it". That is really interesting considering that we have been debating his identity. This issue clearly shows that multiple (often already dead) people have been host to the nanites, and have been called "Bloodshot". However, the doctor says that he was hired to "fix the most technologically advanced project", and the general speaks in the singular as well when he asks, "has he grown his conscience?" This leads me to believe that "Bloodshot" is in fact, not a man at all, but the nanites which managed to gain sentience. I think the Grey Goo was actually an out-of-control batch of non-sentient nanites.

The nanites merely use the bodies as a template. The current iteration of Bloodshot is now different from all of the others, though, due to what Rees has done. Not only did he use the body as a template, but by programming the nanites to consume the mind/soul before death, he has given a sentient machine a soul. I think this is what has lead (in addition to the meddling by Kuretich - isn't that convenient?) to him being able to fight his programming and orders to become a "freewill" - and I think this is VEI's intentional introduction of that VH1 concept into the new universe. I have been wondering if Bloodshot was ever actually "a real boy", but in my opinion this issue states that he is not, nor has he ever been a human being - he is merely a collection of organic machines which has replicated a human - very, very closely in his current form.

He didn't just kill his guards and then run off to kill the architect.

Are you sure? He certainly didn't take the time to change his underwear or wash the blood off of his face.

I think you're right Blood, but I think he was writing the last part just before he was killed, while the General was in the room. If you look, the doctor is writing while talking to the General - at least in the initial coversation.

EDIT: And Bloodshot kills all the witnesses... except the general. He might be the only person alive who actually knows who the current Bloodshot was before he was brought back by the nanites... so there's actually a sliver of hope for him yet.

I really hope we do get some more of the general in the upcoming arcs. It seems like he's the one pulling all of the strings.

Incredible issue, and very horrific to mull over. A soul trapped in Bloodshot is a very interesting and horrific concept. It certainly brings a lot of questions about nuture vs. nature vs. spirituality in play without being too heavy handed with any once concept. It's vague enough to open a discussion, but without taking any definitive stances for the reader. I like that it leaves room for discussion and consideration without spelling everything out.

I love the over the top violence that has become a staple in this series; Bloodshot shooting himself through the head to kill someone standing behind him was gorgasmic. Best comic on the stands.

+1 (gorgasmic may be my new favorite word!)

I really liked this issue, and Bloodshot is (IMHO) the most interesting character in the VEI universe. I definitely see him as the bridge between the modern day and a future VEI timeline (if they do it ). I can't wait to see how they tie Rai into it.

As far as the Ivar reveal that Archer will "destroy Bloodshot", I think that lends even more creedence to my theory that Bloodshot is a machine - he doesn't kill him, but destroys him. I also think this "destruction" may lead to the creation of Rai. Maybe Archer (many years in the future - fully realizing and mastering his abilities) hacks Bloodshot and transforms him into Rai!

August 2013 will be remembered as a turning point for VEI just like Unity was in the 90s. It's subtle this time. This month has been great for me as far as my Image and Marvel books are concerned as well. I am in comic Nirvana!

I thnk he's referred to in the singular as he is meant to be one super solider. The fact that he has sentience (what we can probably agree comes from the nanites) he is still a part of a whole. The fact that these dead soldiers memories live on through a sentient Bloodshot to me means he is essentially MANY men. As I've said earlier, what are we but sentient humans made up of memories? Considering Bloodshot is a vast pool of various people's memories (how many is unknowable) just to me means this character is really the host for the "souls" of many dead soldiers. That's why I maintain his identity is not so easily pinned down in the singular. The fact that they refer to him that way doesn't mean his identity isnt multiplicitous.

And we definitely agree on Bloodshot being the most compelling character in the Valiant universe. Thts why he's my favorite.

[wrunow]

With this issue, Bloodshot has officially surpassed Harbinger to become my favorite VEI title. I am even more nervous for the next issue with the new creative team. Think we can convince VEI to just let Kindt write it? I had never read any of his previous work - I may have to check out Mind MGMT and some of his other work.

I have lots of input, thoughts, theories, and responses to the comments made here, but I'll have to get to it in a little bit. I'm a little busy at work. I'll also be re-reading tonight (I read it quickly this morning while feeding my son breakfast before I took off for work - this issue was very odd juxtaposed against Curious George).

I was afraid of learning too much, as the mystique is what draws me into this book, but Kindt managed to reveal quite a bit while creating more questions than it answered. Awesome!

I think this'll might have been VEI's best issue so far. It would be nice to see Kindt stay on the title, but I think he's got his hands full with the upcoming UNITY books.

[Blood of Heroes]

In the first or second issue, Kuretich says something to the effect of "Oh my beautiful blue eyed boy, what did they make you do?" That made it sound like it was one guy, not a collection of people.

[Phoenix8008]

In the first or second issue, Kuretich says something to the effect of "Oh my beautiful blue eyed boy, what did they make you do?" That made it sound like it was one guy, not a collection of people.

Maybe not very many people (including Kuretich) knew the real origin or exactly WHAT they were actually dealing with?