Dark Horse reviving Doctor Solar, Magnus and Turok

VHMMV · Post by **VHMMV** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:00:49 pm

MoonChild wrote:
VHMMV wrote:
MoonChild wrote:VEI does not need to come up with knock-off characters and that is very cheezy. They own Phil [His alter ego-Solar was only in respect to his favorite comic book] problem solved. Magnus would be missed but could easily crossover from time to time as well as turok [however I dont think turok will be missed by many].
The only company that would benefit from a VEI/Dark Horse crossover would be VEI. In other words, Dark Horse wouldn't care.
Doubt that, they are smarter than that. They want to work with VEI as long as the people that own VEI are reasonable collaborators. Everyone knows the demand for Valiant Characters and DH is a comic company, trust, they care.

Don't take this the wrong way but...

You're thinking like a fanboy.

Dark Horse = big

VEI = small

Dark Horse doesn't need VEI. Dark Horse is a business. Mike Richardson is a businessman. He does what is in Dark Horse's best interests, and no one else's.

You say, "They want to work with VEI..." Really? You know the people at Dark Horse? They confide in you?

"Everyone knows the demand for Valiant Characters..." is overstated by Valiant fans. That was a long time ago. The industry has changed since then.

It's one think to want something, but it's another thing to say that everyone else wants what you want, especially the people that are in a position to make that happen. That's fantasy replacing reality. Mike Richardson doesn't give two *SQUEE* for the people on this board and what they want. If he did, the announcement would have been that Dark Horse and VEI have already teamed up to produce the Gold Key characters, and that wasn't the announcement.

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:12:56 pm

VHMMV wrote:
MoonChild wrote:
VHMMV wrote:
MoonChild wrote:VEI does not need to come up with knock-off characters and that is very cheezy. They own Phil [His alter ego-Solar was only in respect to his favorite comic book] problem solved. Magnus would be missed but could easily crossover from time to time as well as turok [however I dont think turok will be missed by many].
The only company that would benefit from a VEI/Dark Horse crossover would be VEI. In other words, Dark Horse wouldn't care.
Doubt that, they are smarter than that. They want to work with VEI as long as the people that own VEI are reasonable collaborators. Everyone knows the demand for Valiant Characters and DH is a comic company, trust, they care.
Don't take this the wrong way but...

You're thinking like a fanboy.

Dark Horse = big

VEI = small

Dark Horse doesn't need VEI. Dark Horse is a business. Mike Richardson is a businessman. He does what is in Dark Horse's best interests, and no one else's.

You say, "They want to work with VEI..." Really? You know the people at Dark Horse? They confide in you?

"Everyone knows the demand for Valiant Characters..." is overstated by Valiant fans. That was a long time ago. The industry has changed since then.

It's one think to want something, but it's another thing to say that everyone else wants what you want, especially the people that are in a position to make that happen. That's fantasy replacing reality. Mike Richardson doesn't give two *SQUEE* for the people on this board and what they want. If he did, the announcement would have been that Dark Horse and VEI have already teamed up to produce the Gold Key characters, and that wasn't the announcement.

Dude, you may not have posted much, but when you do its good sheeeeeet man.

Orangeribbon · Post by **Orangeribbon** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:15:13 pm

So time to get bare butt on the copy machine with a lamp shade on our heads. Hop to it people.

MoonChild · Post by **MoonChild** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:19:00 pm

Darkhorse Does not Need Valiant but i'm sure they'd like to have em is all I'm saying and yes I mean that by the demand for Valiant Characters. Just look at ebay sales the past several years and you tell me what comics hold collector's value. Anyone that would overlook the value of backissues as a solid point of reference for what's worth something and what's not would be sadly illinformed. Sure Im a big fan of Valiant, infact it's all I read collect. I dont know anyone at DH, I never alluded to that either. I am just saying if your a comic company, as in that is your business: of course you care, everyone wants to have the best product and adding Valiant to their catalog would only be benifical because there is already a demand in place right at the starting gate.

comicsyte95 · Post by **comicsyte95** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:39:08 pm

Its a buisness so Darkhorses main goal is to make $$$ thats why they got Shooter because they want to get a great storyline and make this work for the long hall,they want to sell the most as possible for as long as possible,so I'm sure they care about us here(our $$$ at least).They know how popular Valiant is if they pick up a Overstreet(in the marketing report 2009),or gone on ebay reciently.I'm guessing they want some of that $$$,and i'm going to be a loyal Darkhorse reader when the new titles come out.

Maybe i'm dreaming or just an optimist but i don't see why their couldn't be a VEI/Darkhorse crossover in the future(i don't know if it'll happen but i can dream).

MoonChild · Post by **MoonChild** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:58:35 pm

Agree 100%

comicsyte95 wrote:Its a buisness so Darkhorses main goal is to make $$$ thats why they got Shooter because they want to get a great storyline and make this work for the long hall,they want to sell the most as possible for as long as possible,so I'm sure they care about us here(our $$$ at least).They know how popular Valiant is if they pick up a Overstreet(in the marketing report 2009),or gone on ebay reciently.I'm guessing they want some of that $$$,and i'm going to be a loyal Darkhorse reader when the new titles come out.

Maybe i'm dreaming or just an optimist but i don't see why their couldn't be a VEI/Darkhorse crossover in the future(i don't know if it'll happen but i can dream).

vikingspawn · Post by **vikingspawn** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 9:04:29 pm

http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=22235

The final announcement was the return of a paper version of "Dark Horse Presents." Many new projects will premiere through that medium, including Classic Media characters Doctor Solar, Magnus: Robot Fighter, Turok and Mighty Samson. "We're going to start from scratch and reinvent them," Richardson said, meaning that continuity from Valiant and other publishers would be wiped clean – but Dark Horse has tapped former Valiant publisher Jim Shooter to oversee the line.

"I have a long history with these characters," Shooter told the audience. "I'm gonna give it my best shot. I hope it works out well, and with Mike's help, all things are possible."

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 9:33:57 pm

comicsyte95 wrote: Maybe i'm dreaming or just an optimist but i don't see why their couldn't be a VEI/Darkhorse crossover in the future(i don't know if it'll happen but i can dream).

I'm sure a crossover event at some point down the road may be possible. I think it entirely depends on how well VEI does with the relaunch though. Otherwise I can't see DH being all that interested.

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 9:50:45 pm

You sound abrasive.. So I will throw this at ya, just to make you smile

VHMMV wrote:" Mike Richardson doesn't give two *SQUEE* for the people on this board and what they want. If he did, the announcement would have been that Dark Horse and VEI have already teamed up to produce the Gold Key characters, and that wasn't the announcement.

Someone might reply to YOUR statement like THIS:

VHMMV wrote:" Really? You know the people at Dark Horse? They confide in you?

Its as though the kettle is calling the pot black..

Maybe you DO know Mr. Richardson.. maybe...

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 9:54:19 pm

Im a little bummed about this.. but excited to. It doesnt sound like DH will start with committed titles.. but may work in that direction?

Now we know where VEI stands. Maybe there are plans being laid as this time. I can only hope.

SolarGod · Post by **SolarGod** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:09:33 pm

Great news !! I'm very excited about Shooter getting his hands back on Solar and Magnus. He seems excited about getting another shot at these characters as well. Good work Dark Horse !!

VEI's loss i guess.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:10:55 pm

IanAlexavier wrote:Im a little bummed about this.. but excited to.

I think it's safe to say we are all a little bummed by this. VEI certainly has had it's share of problems to deal with. First vip tries to rip off the trademarks and ties them up in court, then Diamond wouldn't fill the orders on the Harby HC. Also the A&A book gets delayed for some reason when by all appearances everything was ready and waiting. Now Dark Horse one ups them and gets the rights to the GK characters.

I imagine VEI is a little bummed at this point too.

sckao · Post by **sckao** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:16:06 pm

Just my opinion...

VEI's best move right now is to DO NOTHING. Having two "Valiant" universes out there would be MASSIVELY confusing. (I think the Gold Key characters are branded as Valiant/Acclaim characters in popular culture.)

They should hope that the initial 4-book launch by Shooter and Dark Horse succeeds as their own properties will then be worth more. This could give them leverage in the future should Shooter/Dark Horse want to incorporate some of the other properties. (Especially concepts created by Shooter.)

dellamorte · Post by **dellamorte** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:20:51 pm

This is great news. We get to see the characters we love (even if they are somewhat different) written by THE MAN. Dark Horse has an amazing track record of producing quality books, on time.

Has anyone thought about the fact that we could see some of the CGW characters introduced into a new universe with Solar, Magnus and Turok?
This could be some great stuff.

I'm very interested to see how VEI will respond, if at all, to this news. We know that their focus has not been comics to this point, but could a large fan response to this news push them in that direction. IMO, some of the original Valiant characters/titles have just as much recognition among todays fanbase as do the Gold Key 3. They could milk the DH buzz to push their own relaunch plans

xodacia81 · Post by **xodacia81** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:27:51 pm

dellamorte wrote:This is great news. We get to see the characters we love (even if they are somewhat different) written by THE MAN. Dark Horse has an amazing track record of producing quality books, on time.

Has anyone thought about the fact that we could see some of the CGW characters introduced into a new universe with Solar, Magnus and Turok?
This could be some great stuff.

I'm very interested to see how VEI will respond, if at all, to this news. We know that their focus has not been comics to this point, but could a large fan response to this news push them in that direction. IMO, some of the original Valiant characters/titles have just as much recognition among todays fanbase as do the Gold Key 3. They could milk the DH buzz to push their own relaunch plans

Yep. Chiclo, myself and one other had a conversation about that very topic in the chat room a while back. There's a thread even.

iggy101us · Post by **iggy101us** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:29:40 pm

This is exciting news!

DK2 · Post by **DK2** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:54:15 pm

This is not news that DH has the GK characters. The hardcover reprints was already a start. It was announced last year DH was to do new GK stuff but til now they hadn't said anything about the GK properties.
The speculation that the Valiant comics have value and the fans on these boards should interest DH makes no sense at all. What the hell does DH care about the collector/back issue market values of the old Valiant stuff mean to them and have to do with their plans for the GK stuff? Nothing. But to get Shooter on the GK stuff is brilliant. DH's Mike Richardson knows Shooter has a successful history with these characters and knows he's probably the best writer to oversee their efforts on the GK stuff.
Where does VEI stand now? They've shown no initiative beyond the HC reprints. Have they run out of money? Are their resources drying up? Is the economies current state hurting them? They've shown no plans on going into comics publishing.
We shouldn't assume that DH and VEI would automatically do a team up. But its got a possibilty. Remember Shooter has done those short stories for them in 2 of the 3 HC's. He and VEI could easily try to persuade DH to absorb VEI and have them as a DH imprint line of a superhero universe. If they simply do a crossover this could easily create a story where the VEI universe splits up a bit and cheaply explain the loss of the GK characters to create a permament backstory of their absence from the Valiant U. These are the only things I see as any logic for DH and VEI to remotely do anything together. Valiant nostalgia interest on DH GK launch and for VEI to move on without the GK characters, may help each other in some way.
As for the DH GK run, I'm interested in checking up on Shooter's second coming on them.

magnusr · Post by **magnusr** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:24:16 am

MoonChild wrote:
hulk181man wrote:This news is both exciting and disappointing at the same time.

/Magnus

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:24:48 am

MoonChild wrote:Darkhorse Does not Need Valiant but i'm sure they'd like to have em is all I'm saying and yes I mean that by the demand for Valiant Characters. Just look at ebay sales the past several years and you tell me what comics hold collector's value. Anyone that would overlook the value of backissues as a solid point of reference for what's worth something and what's not would be sadly illinformed.

I am not sure if that is a wholly accurate statement. It has merit, yes because the $$$ numbers are there, but WHO is demanding these issues ? IS Valiant super hot all over the place or have WE as huge fans (and a relatively small group) drove the prices up on Valiant back issues. I remember upon first joining this message board (June 2003, when I was known as Knightt_333 or The Evil Knightt hehe. No worries, Knightt_333 is dead. MAN, if you think I am a jerk NOW, you should have been around back THEN.... whew dum diggity), prices were CHEAP. I remember getting stuff off Ebay for next to nothing and then the more we chatted about it, then got into a few Ebay bidding wars over an issue, things started to pick up. Because WE were doing it. There are serious collectors out there with deep pockets that are not board members to consider as well but how do we 'really' know if there is a huge demand for Valiant comics on Ebay (using prices for analysis) by many people or just a high demand/willingness to pay a lot for certain Valiant issues by the few of us ?

leonmallett · Post by **leonmallett** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:30:39 am

Draco wrote:This does make me wonder even more now about the people who maybe knew something was happening in the background at VEI.

This deal must have been done some time ago i would imagine and the perfect time to announce it obviously at the Con.

So if DH can keep this quiet then VEI too can have stuff happening without letting slip. I hope.

But Dark Horse haven't kept this quiet - they have been clear about their plans for a long time, as seen in these links:

Link

Link

Dark Horse appear to have clearly kept to their plan, whereas the VEI plan as it appears doesn't seem to be about new comic books (and no, I don't count the bonus material in the HC's).

I am all for optimism, but I think in terms of comic books (not in terms of multi-media exploitation of the VEI properties), VEI are trading on a lot of optimism and good faith.

MoonChild · Post by **MoonChild** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:13:26 am

I'm actually starting to get excited at the idea of Shooter doing something with Turok, I think that combination is a golden opportunity for greatness.

leonmallett · Post by **leonmallett** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:17:16 am

I just had a tangential thought - I know discussion has occurred about CGW, but another idea that occurs is about some of the other 60's superheroes that Dark Horse have archived: Magicman and Nemesis. Now the old stuff was very campy, but the basic characters could be very workable (I feel) alongside a more superheroic Doctor Solar et al.

magnus20009 · Post by **magnus20009** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 8:05:01 am

DK2 wrote: The speculation that the Valiant comics have value and the fans on these boards should interest DH makes no sense at all. What the hell does DH care about the collector/back issue market values of the old Valiant stuff mean to them and have to do with their plans for the GK stuff?

I couldn't disagree more with this statement. DH would not be reviving these characters if it were not for the 90's valiant run.

I am a valiant fan (albeit don't frequent this board much but with this announcement needed to) and I have bought all the Magnus/Solar/Turok archives that DH has released. I very much think that they care that so many of us (whether on this board or not) love Valiant Comics. If no one cared about Valiant anymore and all the backissues were selling for a dozen a dollar I highly doubt DH would think it made business sense to get the old Valiant Characters (I highly doubt anyone under 45 thinks of them as GK characters).

Whether they care about VEI or want to work with them is another question altogether.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:09:14 am

leonmallett wrote:I just had a tangential thought - I know discussion has occurred about CGW, but another idea that occurs is about some of the other 60's superheroes that Dark Horse have archived: Magicman and Nemesis. Now the old stuff was very campy, but the basic characters could be very workable (I feel) alongside a more superheroic Doctor Solar et al.

In the beginning of Valiant, it was Shooter's intention to revive more of the GK characters and some books were even solicited, but for whatever reason never came to pass. Personally I don't think some of those characters would have made a good fit into the Valiant Universe, but Jim has a fresh slate now, so maybe he can pull it off.

leonmallett · Post by **leonmallett** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:10:34 am

magnus20009 wrote:I couldn't disagree more with this statement. DH would not be reviving these characters if it were not for the 90's valiant run.

Really? Given their (Dark Horse's) publication of Gold Key-based story archives, I would say that the Gold Key era is their touchstone, not the VALIANT-era.

I am a valiant fan (albeit don't frequent this board much but with this announcement needed to) and I have bought all the Magnus/Solar/Turok archives that DH has released. I very much think that they care that so many of us (whether on this board or not) love Valiant Comics. If no one cared about Valiant anymore and all the backissues were selling for a dozen a dollar I highly doubt DH would think it made business sense to get the old Valiant Characters (I highly doubt anyone under 45 thinks of them as GK characters).

As noted by a prior poster, back issue prices have little bearing on decisions; Dark Horse will be making a judgement based on a combination of properties/characters, creators and publication strategy.

Whether they care about VEI or want to work with them is another question altogether.

It seems to only be a question amongst VALIANT-fans. And even then not all of us. I see it as a non-issue since there is no indication of any such tie-up at this time.