4001 AD 1:100 B&W

[Nairbe]

HOLY SNIKES!

I was thinking of picking up more then one copy, but that's too rich for my blood. 1 copy max for me.

https://www.dcbservice.com/product/mar161799/4001-ad-1-(of-4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)-cvr-i-100-copy-incv-bw-interlock-sook

[JCP]

I'm sure this will be included in Ed's soon-to-come 4001 AD buying package at a more affordable price with more books than just this one.

[mkb28]

I have found that DCBS discounts the 1:10 and 1:20 variants, but the 1:40 and higher variants usually go for equal value and sometimes even higher, in this case. I am passing on all of them and buying the Deluxe HC when it is released.

By the way, the new Rai Volume 1 Deluxe HC is 50% off at $19.99 with DCBS!

mkb28

[Nairbe]

I'm sure this will be included in Ed's soon-to-come 4001 AD buying package at a more affordable price with more books than just this one.

Good observation on the 1:40+'s at DCBS, I believe you may be right.

I did notice the Rai price!

[Joshua]

I have had great luck buying most of my variants cheap off Ebay. I don't really care about having them all but holy crap, that's an outrageous price for that book.

[Nameless7]

I am sorry to be even thinking this but Valiant's marketing with the variant covers is starting to look much too similar to Dynamite for my taste.

[magnusr]

I have found that DCBS discounts the 1:10 and 1:20 variants, but the 1:40 and higher variants usually go for equal value and sometimes even higher, in this case. I am passing on all of them and buying the Deluxe HC when it is released.

By the way, the new Rai Volume 1 Deluxe HC is 50% off at $19.99 with DCBS!

mkb28

Would assume that for the scarcer variants they price after a "one of each" model. They assume that for each 1:100 they sell, they will only sell one 1:50, even though they qualify for two, and only one 1:10 even though they qualify for 10, and so on. For the lesser variants, the regular issues cover them so those can be priced lower.

Anyway, DCBS is a casino with stacked cards. mailordercomics had a much better business model, but unfortunately they are gone. DCBS has to take a gamble on how much they will sell of each variant when pricing. Thing is, if they price things to low, then they just cancel these items when it's too late for the customer to adjust the rest of their orders. So they win either way.

If I were them I would either do as mailordercomics did and allow a variant only after you've ordered enough regulars, or I would price the rare variants even higher, but sell less rare variants and regulars at a cheaper price for those who have bought the rare variant. Either way there would be no price gauging involved.

/Magnus

PS, I will never ever again order from DCBS, but not because of their price gauging but because they actually had the audacity to blame VEI when they made mistakes.

[magnusr]

I am sorry to be even thinking this but Valiant's marketing with the variant covers is starting to look much too similar to Dynamite (sucks!) for my taste.

Looking around I have had to realize that's how the market looks nowadays, but I must agree with you. From the beginning I really thought this was just something for the first few issues, to get the company started, but then it just rolled on and even intensified. As long as we buy the variants I guess it's tempting for VEI to go on. They are providing what many customers obviously want.

Btw, Eric Stephenson touched upon this subject in a thought-provoking speech recently:
http://comicsalliance.com/image-eric-st ... ro-speech/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

/Magnus

[cray_ws]

I am sorry to be even thinking this but Valiant's marketing with the variant covers is starting to look much too similar to Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) for my taste.

Looking around I have had to realize that's how the market looks nowadays, but I must agree with you. From the beginning I really thought this was just something for the first few issues, to get the company started, but then it just rolled on and even intensified. As long as we buy the variants I guess it's tempting for VEI to go on. They are providing what many customers obviously want.

Btw, Eric Stephenson touched upon this subject in a thought-provoking speech recently:
http://comicsalliance.com/image-eric-st ... ro-speech/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

/Magnus

Yep....Valiant is trolling their fans just like Dynamite and most won't admit it here. The Book of Death: Legends of the Geomancer was the biggest conjob of them all and there's gonna be more because fans on these boards are unapologetic collectors of the Valiant brand. *SQUEE* with a Valiant logo would sell if marketed as a variant.

Stephenson has been preaching genre diversity and wider audience acceptance for awhile now and Marvel and DC fans have been calling him a hater and a pimp for Image. I agree with almost everything he's said in that article. I'm *SQUEE* tired of variants.

[Phantom]

MagnusR thanks for sharing that article.

The article reminds me of an early episode of OTV when ZWH did mini rant (in a good way) about how the industry could of saved itself from the huge crash of the 90's.

Someone needs to stand up and be a voice of reason for change. THe industry if they can, they will, take as much money from us as they can. Their will never be any sensibility to this ~ if you are willing to give them money, they will take it by the fistfull.

It will not change, as Marvel will continue to do whatever it takes to take as much money, the consumer has to be the one that dictates to the market. Just don't buy it.

My spending habits at valiant have changed. I feel the need to support valiant with my monthly comic purchase, otherwise I will not get to read the stories in Hardcover. I want to buy only by hardcovers as I get to overwhelmed by all the different covers.

If it was just a standard issue each month I would return to getting every comic, as it is, I buy random valiant comics from online comic shops and whenever I visit a comic shop store front (I will buy one of each issue). I have boxes of valiant comics, just random issues ~ spending buying to support valiant and comic shop owners.

Their is nothing special about the variants accept the cover, it is never a special anniversary or number issue ~ its all the time. So just completely lost interest. I wonder how many others feel the same.

Saying that,I just turned 40 ~ so maybe its the old man talking.

[Keith]

I am sorry to be even thinking this but Valiant's marketing with the variant covers is starting to look much too similar to Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) (sucks!) for my taste.

Looking around I have had to realize that's how the market looks nowadays, but I must agree with you. From the beginning I really thought this was just something for the first few issues, to get the company started, but then it just rolled on and even intensified. As long as we buy the variants I guess it's tempting for VEI to go on. They are providing what many customers obviously want.

Btw, Eric Stephenson touched upon this subject in a thought-provoking speech recently:
http://comicsalliance.com/image-eric-st ... ro-speech/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

/Magnus

Yep....Valiant is trolling their fans just like Dynamite (sucks!) and most won't admit it here. The Book of Death: Legends of the Geomancer was the biggest conjob of them all and there's gonna be more because fans on these boards are unapologetic collectors of the Valiant brand. *SQUEE* with a Valiant logo would sell if marketed as a variant.

Stephenson has been preaching genre diversity and wider audience acceptance for awhile now and Marvel and DC fans have been calling him a hater and a pimp for Image. I agree with almost everything he's said in that article. I'm *SQUEE* tired of variants.

[nycjadie]

When did double-shipping become a term over bi-monthly? It's not intuitive to me at all about what it means. Weird.

Anyway, I like variant covers and gimmicks.

[Nameless7]

When did double-shipping become a term over bi-monthly? It's not intuitive to me at all about what it means. Weird.

Anyway, I like variant covers and gimmicks.

I like variants too. But there is such a thing as 'too damn much'. Personally, I quite like the 3-4 cover runs that titles like Imperium, Ninjak, X-O are doing. If not for Ed's deals, I would have dropped all Valiant completely (I only buy Valiant comics btw)

[jeremycoe]

When did double-shipping become a term over bi-monthly? It's not intuitive to me at all about what it means. Weird.

Anyway, I like variant covers and gimmicks.

The problem with using the term bimonthly is that it can (correctly) mean either twice a month or every two months. Context doesn't even help, usually. I don't know if I like the term "double-shipping", either.

[jeremycoe]

I am sorry to be even thinking this but Valiant's marketing with the variant covers is starting to look much too similar to Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) (sucks!) for my taste.

Looking around I have had to realize that's how the market looks nowadays, but I must agree with you. From the beginning I really thought this was just something for the first few issues, to get the company started, but then it just rolled on and even intensified. As long as we buy the variants I guess it's tempting for VEI to go on. They are providing what many customers obviously want.

Btw, Eric Stephenson touched upon this subject in a thought-provoking speech recently:
http://comicsalliance.com/image-eric-st ... ro-speech/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

/Magnus

Yep....Valiant is trolling their fans just like Dynamite (sucks!) and most won't admit it here. The Book of Death: Legends of the Geomancer was the biggest conjob of them all and there's gonna be more because fans on these boards are unapologetic collectors of the Valiant brand. *SQUEE* with a Valiant logo would sell if marketed as a variant.

Stephenson has been preaching genre diversity and wider audience acceptance for awhile now and Marvel and DC fans have been calling him a hater and a pimp for Image. I agree with almost everything he's said in that article. I'm *SQUEE* tired of variants.

"Trolling" - nice. I don't think that means what you think it means.

Stephenson has some good points. Out of the many problems he pointed out, his company is only not guilty of one of them - exclusive variants. And that's just recently. And they'll still do exclusive variants on trades, so how is that any different really? I personally am much more bothered by late books, Image's specialty, than I am about variants. I have the choice to buy variants or not, I can't buy a book that hasn't been released yet.

[Nairbe]

I like variants too. But there is such a thing as 'too damn much'

THIS!

New series/mini's are just brutal with that variants. I know it's not just a Valiant problem (ie..$5,000 DKIII variant is variant insanity at the max).

[paradise]

Oh, boy, this post is MY THANG! for sure.

1. We will have something for 4001, and if you like variants, you may want to hold off spending $150 for one of them

2. Re: PRICE of that variant, here is something I posted on Facebook, I will just copy / paste:
I also want to point out that consumers are not always fully aware of all the decisions that go into retailer's ordering and determination of what to charge for certain books. Please understand that just because two books both have a 1:100 variant, does not mean they will be priced the same by the retailer. That's too simplistic. It depends on many things, among them:
1. How many copies a retailer orders
2. How many variants are offered, at what ratios (more variants mean cost of each one is subsidized by all others)
3. What pricing or returnability incentives VEI and Diamond offer to the retailer in order to buy more copies, resulting in more variants
4. What the retailer thinks of the long term potential of sales of extra copies (mini series have shorter life, so we are less likely to want to invest in them by ordering more copies)
5. Popularity of the character/book in question (we are likely to charge more for a variant of a book that is more in demand, pure and simple
6. Popularity of the artist who does the cover
7. How nice is the cover itself.

There are a few reasons, these just come to mind off the top of my head. Retailing is not that simple and you guys always try to use past experiences to predict stuff, and it's not always accurate because you don't have all the data. I am not saying run and get that variant (up to you and your budget) but please try not to use terms like GOUGING because those guys have been in business for a while, and while I may not be a fan, they still deserve your respect because .....

THEY PUT UP 100% of the risk buying those books and they (and other retailers) are the reason you get to enjoy the titles you like.

[paradise]

Stephenson has been preaching genre diversity and wider audience acceptance for awhile now and Marvel and DC fans have been calling him a hater and a pimp for Image. I agree with almost everything he's said in that article. I'm *SQUEE* tired of variants.

I have talked to Eric a few times, and I like the guy, and he's done a lot for this industry, BUT...

HE IS FULL OF S H I T on this issue. He's completely hypocritical. Image had done more variants in the last few years than most. Image has done more retailer variants (including with me) in the last few years than most. Image, all of a sudden, a few months ago, decided to stop those, so that Eric can be all righteous, but what they are not telling you is that they have a new Retailer Variant graphic novel program. If a store orders 400 (400!!!!!) copies of a new Image GN, they get an exclusive cover. 400! For me, two books sold that many copies, Saga Vol 1, and Walking Dead vol 1. And we are a 2 store chain that sells more GNs than most stores around us. Our whole business model is built on them. Image thinks that every vol 1 can sell Walking Dead #1 numbers. And that's a disconnect with the marketplace, and can damage a retailer's bottom line much more and much quicker than 1,000 exclusive variants, at $2 each.

The other thing he does not understand is this : A customer who buys variants is not the same guy who just reads comics. It's not like he spends $50 on a Variant and does not buy $50 more of books. That person would just spend $50 less at a comic book store and go buy a video game. The variant buyer enjoys collecting and hunting for different covers. And there is nothing wrong with that. We need all types of customers not just readers.

[nycjadie]

The other thing he does not understand is this : A customer who buys variants is not the same guy who just reads comics.

This.

[Nairbe]

The variant buyer enjoys collecting and hunting for different covers

I wouldn't say I enjoy it...it's more of an addiction.

[cray_ws]

"Trolling" - nice. I don't think that means what you think it means.

Stephenson has some good points. Out of the many problems he pointed out, his company is only not guilty of one of them - exclusive variants. And that's just recently. And they'll still do exclusive variants on trades, so how is that any different really? I personally am much more bothered by late books, Image's specialty, than I am about variants. I have the choice to buy variants or not, I can't buy a book that hasn't been released yet.

I know what trolling means...and anyone thinking you're not being made to look like suckers for buying variants are completely ignorant of the industry. Variants aren't gifts, they aren't fan service items for cool factor. No...they are there for publishers amusement to see how many suckers they can get to buy a comic with a different cover. They are short term boost in sales so publishers can have some pocket money.

Variants are fool's gold. They ARE trolling you, whether you want to admit it or not. There's no sound reason to publish a comic with multiple covers, nor are there any rational reason to buy multiple copies of the same book as if they are collectors items when clearly they aren't, no matter how low the print run is. There's so many variants out there that there's never going a rare one.

[greg]

Variants are fool's gold. They ARE trolling you, whether you want to admit it or not. There's no sound reason to publish a comic with multiple covers, nor are there any rational reason to buy multiple copies of the same book as if they are collectors items when clearly they aren't, no matter how low the print run is. There's so many variants out there that there's never going a rare one.

There is no sound reason to create variant quarters with the 50 states on them, nor any reason to try to collect all 50 states of 25cent pieces which are worth 25cents.
There are hundreds of millions of coins and people in every city acting like they've got to collect them.

The U.S. Mint is trolling.

[jeremycoe]

"Trolling" - nice. I don't think that means what you think it means.

Stephenson has some good points. Out of the many problems he pointed out, his company is only not guilty of one of them - exclusive variants. And that's just recently. And they'll still do exclusive variants on trades, so how is that any different really? I personally am much more bothered by late books, Image's specialty, than I am about variants. I have the choice to buy variants or not, I can't buy a book that hasn't been released yet.

I know what trolling means...and anyone thinking you're not being made to look like suckers for buying variants are completely ignorant of the industry. Variants aren't gifts, they aren't fan service items for cool factor. No...they are there for publishers amusement to see how many suckers they can get to buy a comic with a different cover. They are short term boost in sales so publishers can have some pocket money.

Variants are fool's gold. They ARE trolling you, whether you want to admit it or not. There's no sound reason to publish a comic with multiple covers, nor are there any rational reason to buy multiple copies of the same book as if they are collectors items when clearly they aren't, no matter how low the print run is. There's so many variants out there that there's never going a rare one.

Even if that's what they are doing (which I don't completely agree with), that's still not trolling. But, someone posting on here only to start arguments and make people mad is.

[nycjadie]

Nobody is forced to buy variants. I've never understood being upset about them.

Nobody is forced to buy issues. Collected editions are available for everything now.

Lots of options for everyone.

What is true is that people buy less Comics now than they used to. Therefore, I have no issue with employing creative marketing to meet the bottom line

[mkb28]

I was just talking to a fellow board member the other day about how our collecting habits have changed over the last 2-3 years. I used to collect all the variant covers for all the #1 issues and I even collected all the retailer variant covers on several titles. I think my appetite for variants started to change with the Wrath of the Eternal Warrior and the Book of Death books. I decided to buy all the issues from both series, but it was very discouraging to see the 1:60 variants selling on eBay for $15.00 soon after my purchase. I think that is when I said enough is enough and decided to quit wasting my money. Some of the variants hold their value or even increase in value, but most decline in value very quickly.

Another reason my collecting habits have changed is my kids are approaching college age and the money could go to better use. So for now, I am transitioning over to trades and HC's and I am no longer buying the monthly issues. I am also selling off most of my slabs collection, with the exception of my VEI GOLD CGC 9.8 slabs.

I do think the endless amount of variants do start to turn off the fan base at some point.

Mkb28