A new Valiant could still use Phil Seleski, if not Solar...

[ManofTheAtom]

not trying to be negative, but what if it takes the new VALIANT 3 years to get the rights to solar? that is a long time to have the Q? remain unresolved...alot of books would be published in that time....i think the situation has to be addressed in some way..."outing" solar to the world the way that jurgens did, could be the best way to do that-phil realizes that everyone knows who he is, and since he wants to continue fighting bad guys, but also wants privacy, he changes his name and costume. that's not hard, or far-fetched.

And it would make for a GREAT story arc, but NOT the status quo.

What would you rather see for the first Solar story in 10 years?

Phil's return to Earth to discover that he can't be Solar because of copyright, or Solar's valiant return to Earth in its greatest time of need followed by a hero's welcome?

In other words, shouldn't the characters be reintroduced in the best light possible as opposed to the most mundane way imaginable?

Think of Phil as a GI returning home from WWII.

Before the war this GI had a job, life, and gf that are no longer there when he comes back, so he has to find replacements (a new job, a new life, and a new gf)... but imagine what if after that he got his old job, life, and gf back?

That's what needs to happen with Phil, but not right out of the gate (not unless VE can launch with an event that revolves around Solar, which they would need to have the rights for).

[ManofTheAtom]

Ah, it's good to see others chime in!

The way X-O was gutted (no more Orb Industries) and its desperately-needed supporting cast removed (Ken, Randy Cartier) makes that title alone desperately in need of a reboot.

Not if everything from when BQuake began is dismissed as a story where Aric was trapped inside a virtual reality simulation by the former owner of Orb, who Gonzalez introduced in his last issue of the series.

[cjv]

I think using Phil Seleski as another character would work very well. I have, in fact, suggested it before.

After everything that has happened to him, he could realized that being a "superhero" like his idol (Solar) isn't all it is cracked up to be. Life in the "real" world is seldom as simple and straightforward as the comics he is used to.

Thus, as part of a maturing process, he could shed his "Solar" identity, and pick up something else...heck, he could just even remain "Phil Seleski", no need for a costumed superhero name. Just look how much trouble it caused before.

And it still leaves open the possibility of RETURNING to become "Solar" at some future date.

But shedding the Solar identity, one he adopted himself, doesn't mean he has to lose his powers, or anything like that. It can simply be a maturing process, something that he has been undergoing since the beginning.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

In other words, the new VALIANT may not have the rights to Solar, but they could still have Phil Seleski, and simply create a new name for his hero persona, like SunStroke or something like that. They could even incorporate a funny story about how he got sued by the people who owned the rights to Solar. And that way, you could again use Erica Pierce as a villain.

This wouldn't work as Phil didn't read a Sunstroke or something like that comic book, he grew up specifically reading Doctor Solar comics that inspired him to build the reactor and wish he could become just like him.

Phil's basically a big fanboy who was transformed into his comic book hero. Any deviation of that would be an indication that he's moving away from his childhood, which at worse could end up invalidating the "wish" that turned him into Solar in the first place.

While this might be a good idea for a story, I don't see it working as a new status quo.

Got an opinion?

It could work, if you simply use the discarding of the "Solar" identity as a maturing process. No one is saying he NEVER was Solar, just that he isn't now.

Chris

And that would work as a short term arc.

Phil became Solar because he read Doctor Solar comics as a kid and grew up to build a reactor hoping that it would blow up and transform him into his comic book hero.

The question is, what would happen to Phil is he matured away from that and assumed a different identity? Would he retain his powers? Would what caused the accident in the first place revert itself?

These are interesting questions to ask and answer, but it makes for an extremely lousy and boring status quo as Solar, not Sunstroke, is VALIANT'S Superman.

If VE's going to start changing the character's name, then why should I care what they publish?

I can't believe the consensus gathered on this board.

Selective continuity, different names for the characters, rewritten dates... I thought we waited for VALIANT, not DC Lite.

Yes, I said it again because that's what it sounds like here.

What happened to tight continuity and all the other things that made VALIANT what it was?

[bamaphilosopher]

I agree, cjv! Even if they had to totally reboot, they could still say Solar was his inspiration, but he decided to go beyond that. (Especially if they'd do a story where the "Solar" owners decided to sue.)

[dave]

your example of a GI returning is a perfect example of what you just said that Phil should not become though, mike...he was just in war, and now he returns to the mundane...it takes adjustments...

what would a guy who had only recently returned from being merged with the sun want to do?

my best friend's wife asked us what she should bring when she met us upon our return...i asked her to bring some fresh milk. dude, i hadn't had a nice cold glass of milk for 7 months, and that is what i wanted...and then i wanted to go to taco bell...pretty mundane.

if the world knew about this hero, solar, and he suddenly returned, they might expect certain things from him...and he might not want to oblige.
part of his character was his on again off again desire for a normal life (which was often in response to gayle's desire for a normal life) so i think his desire to keep things low key for a while is fairly consistent with the character, and is a pretty convenient way to sidestep the solar TM issues unti they are resolved...

i do like the ten years later idea, however, far better than anything else i've seen. picking up after unity is not the way to go (IMO)...a complete reboot is probably not the best way to go either...

[cjv]

In other words, the new VALIANT may not have the rights to Solar, but they could still have Phil Seleski, and simply create a new name for his hero persona, like SunStroke or something like that. They could even incorporate a funny story about how he got sued by the people who owned the rights to Solar. And that way, you could again use Erica Pierce as a villain.

This wouldn't work as Phil didn't read a Sunstroke or something like that comic book, he grew up specifically reading Doctor Solar comics that inspired him to build the reactor and wish he could become just like him.

Phil's basically a big fanboy who was transformed into his comic book hero. Any deviation of that would be an indication that he's moving away from his childhood, which at worse could end up invalidating the "wish" that turned him into Solar in the first place.

While this might be a good idea for a story, I don't see it working as a new status quo.

Got an opinion?

It could work, if you simply use the discarding of the "Solar" identity as a maturing process. No one is saying he NEVER was Solar, just that he isn't now.

Chris

And that would work as a short term arc.

Phil became Solar because he read Doctor Solar comics as a kid and grew up to build a reactor hoping that it would blow up and transform him into his comic book hero.

The question is, what would happen to Phil is he matured away from that and assumed a different identity? Would he retain his powers? Would what caused the accident in the first place revert itself?

These are interesting questions to ask and answer, but it makes for an extremely lousy and boring status quo as Solar, not Sunstroke, is VALIANT'S Superman.

If VE's going to start changing the character's name, then why should I care what they publish?

I can't believe the consensus gathered on this board.

Selective continuity, different names for the characters, rewritten dates... I thought we waited for VALIANT, not DC Lite.

Yes, I said it again because that's what it sounds like here.

What happened to tight continuity and all the other things that made VALIANT what it was?

Sorry, edited on you.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

your example of a GI returning is a perfect example of what you just said that Phil should not become though, mike...he was just in war, and now he returns to the mundane...it takes adjustments...

what would a guy who had only recently returned from being merged with the sun want to do?

my best friend's wife asked us what she should bring when she met us upon our return...i asked her to bring some fresh milk. dude, i hadn't had a nice cold glass of milk for 7 months, and that is what i wanted...and then i wanted to go to taco bell...pretty mundane.

if the world knew about this hero, solar, and he suddenly returned, they might expect certain things from him...and he might not want to oblige.
part of his character was his on again off again desire for a normal life (which was often in response to gayle's desire for a normal life) so i think his desire to keep things low key for a while is fairly consistent with the character, and is a pretty convenient way to sidestep the solar TM issues unti they are resolved...

i do like the ten years later idea, however, far better than anything else i've seen. picking up after unity is not the way to go (IMO)...a complete reboot is probably not the best way to go either...

I don't disagree with you, but such a story should be the second one that VE makes, not the first one, not the introductory story.

The introduction should be of massive scope, a big bang concept that shows off what makes the characters unique and great.

After that, once Phil returns to his average life, he can deal with the issue of copyright (which is a PERFECT reflection of the real world setting), but that should come with a cost.

Can Phil move away from the Solar identity without loosing his powers and very existance?

Can Phil exist without Solar?

The answer has to be a definite no, which would force him to return to his id.

Solar = milk

Sunstroke = Coke

[bamaphilosopher]

"Selective continuity, different names for the characters, rewritten dates... I thought we waited for VALIANT, not DC Lite."

You can't go with Rai 0 continuity and keep the original characters, as I explained above. It just doesn't work. It's been ten years with no comics, no stories.

And talk about selective continuity--that's what they did when they destroyed titles like X-O (Aric had Orb Industries in Rai 0). And they'd still be selective under your system, because they'd be ignoring VH2, etc.

Sometimes, when comics universes are a mess, they have to reboot (a la Crisis, etc.).

[ManofTheAtom]

I think using Phil Seleski as another character would work very well. I have, in fact, suggested it before.

After everything that has happened to him, he could realized that being a "superhero" like his idol (Solar) isn't all it is cracked up to be. Life in the "real" world is seldom as simple and straightforward as the comics he is used to.

Thus, as part of a maturing process, he could shed his "Solar" identity, and pick up something else...heck, he could just even remain "Phil Seleski", no need for a costumed superhero name. Just look how much trouble it caused before.

And it still leaves open the possibility of RETURNING to become "Solar" at some future date.

But shedding the Solar identity, one he adopted himself, doesn't mean he has to lose his powers, or anything like that. It can simply be a maturing process, something that he has been undergoing since the beginning.

Chris

That's the way he would look at it ("I'm only changing my name and using a different uniform. What's the worst that could happen?"), but he could be wrong.

The question of how it was possible for a man to gain powers by throwing himself into a nuclear reactor has never been explored. This "Sunstroke" idea is the perfect gateway into that concept.

It's like that episode of Family Guy, where the family gains powers after being exposed to nuclear waste while Adam West gets cancer after doing the same.

In the real world nuclear radiation doesn't grant people special powers, but it did for Phil.

Why?

And could what granted him those powers also take them away if he distanced himself from the Solar id?

[cjv]

Phil became Solar because he read Doctor Solar comics as a kid and grew up to build a reactor hoping that it would blow up and transform him into his comic book hero.

Ecept that Phil didn't BECOME Solar - he emulated him. Yes, he created a version of Solar in the real world, but eventually that version of Solar merged with Phil (who then merged with himself). Solar, the comic book character, never existed except for a short while as a construct of Phil Seleski.

The question is, what would happen to Phil is he matured away from that and assumed a different identity? Would he retain his powers? Would what caused the accident in the first place revert itself?

Why wouldn't he retain his power? The accident happened, he got his powers - it doesn't mean he has to remain static. IMO, unless he specifically did something to PREVENT his gaining power (which would be an interesting story, and perhaps another way to fashion a reboot if desired), the accident DID happen - he DID want the powers, initially because he thought it would be "cool" to be Solar, and now because he has matured beyond that but still sees his abilities as something helpful/useful/heroic, even if he doesn't don a red costume anymore.

These are interesting questions to ask and answer, but it makes for an extremely lousy and boring status quo as Solar, not Sunstroke, is VALIANT'S Superman.

I would argue Phil Seleski is Valiant's Clark Kent. The power is there, the character is there, if he dons a red suit or a blue leotard, he can still be the character. It isn't the name or the suit that makes the man.

Of course, it might be a little more difficult if he dons a blue leotard.

If VE's going to start changing the character's name, then why should I care what they publish?

Because (hopefully) the writing will be good, and the character will still be the same. You mean to tell me that if Sting changed his "codename" to something else, you suddenly wouldn't care about the Harbingers anymore?

I can't believe the consensus gathered on this board.

Selective continuity, different names for the characters, rewritten dates... I thought we waited for VALIANT, not DC Lite.

Yes, I said it again because that's what it sounds like here.

And here we go again.

What happened to tight continuity and all the other things that made VALIANT what it was?

Again, tight continuity doesn't have to mean EVERYTHING IS EXACTLY THE SAME! You can have tight continuity starting fresh - keeping continuiting with the currently written comics. You can have tight continuity and still change things, such as character names and/or costumes.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

"Selective continuity, different names for the characters, rewritten dates... I thought we waited for VALIANT, not DC Lite."

You can't go with Rai 0 continuity and keep the original characters, as I explained above. It just doesn't work. It's been ten years with no comics, no stories.

And talk about selective continuity--that's what they did when they destroyed titles like X-O (Aric had Orb Industries in Rai 0). And they'd still be selective under your system, because they'd be ignoring VH2, etc.

Sometimes, when comics universes are a mess, they have to reboot (a la Crisis, etc.).

VH 2 came out of a crossover between X-O Manowar and Iron Man.

How can that be possible when in the VALIANT Universe Iron Man is a comic book character?

Conan was fake, Batman was fake, Star Trek was fake.

You do know that the X-Men crossovered with two different generations of Star Trek, right?

The premise and basis of the X-O Manowar/Iron Man crossover contradict the premise and basis of the VALIANT Universe (heroes outside your window), so why should it and VH 2 be given any consideration when all they do is diminish what VALIANT was all about?

This isn't about selective continuity, it's about repairing the damage that was done to the VU.

[cjv]

The answer has to be a definite no, which would force him to return to his id.

Why?

Chris

[cjv]

I think using Phil Seleski as another character would work very well. I have, in fact, suggested it before.

After everything that has happened to him, he could realized that being a "superhero" like his idol (Solar) isn't all it is cracked up to be. Life in the "real" world is seldom as simple and straightforward as the comics he is used to.

Thus, as part of a maturing process, he could shed his "Solar" identity, and pick up something else...heck, he could just even remain "Phil Seleski", no need for a costumed superhero name. Just look how much trouble it caused before.

And it still leaves open the possibility of RETURNING to become "Solar" at some future date.

But shedding the Solar identity, one he adopted himself, doesn't mean he has to lose his powers, or anything like that. It can simply be a maturing process, something that he has been undergoing since the beginning.

Chris

That's the way he would look at it ("I'm only changing my name and using a different uniform. What's the worst that could happen?"), but he could be wrong.

You are right, he could be wrong, but you are assuming he HAS to be wrong. As you stated, he HAS TO STAY SOLAR, which is your assumption, but it doesn't mean it is has to be that way.

And could what granted him those powers also take them away if he distanced himself from the Solar id?

I agree, an interesting story line would be delving more into HOW Solar/Phil got his powers. But you seem to think that answer to the above questions HAS to be yes, while it doesn't.

Chris

[cjv]

How can that be possible when in the VALIANT Universe Iron Man is a comic book character?

Umm...in the Valiant Universe, Solar is ALSO a comic book character. Phil looked at some Solar comics.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

Why wouldn't he retain his power? The accident happened, he got his powers - it doesn't mean he has to remain static. IMO, unless he specifically did something to PREVENT his gaining power (which would be an interesting story, and perhaps another way to fashion a reboot if desired), the accident DID happen - he DID want the powers, initially because he thought it would be "cool" to be Solar, and now because he has matured beyond that but still sees his abilities as something helpful/useful/heroic, even if he doesn't don a red costume anymore.

What happens to Aladdin when someone takes the lamp from him?

All of his wishes are canceled out and he returns to rags, while the effect of those wishes remains (I don't mean effect like he retains his riches, but effect like the Princess knows that he had been rich but isn't anymore because it was all created by the Genie).

So, what would happen to Phil if someone took the lamp from him (or he walked away from it as the case would be if he discarted the Solar identity)?

The accident that transformed Phil mirrored Raymond Solar's origin. He specifically created a reactor because that's what transformed Raymond and he wanted the same thing to happen to him.

I would argue Phil Seleski is VALIANT's Clark Kent. The power is there, the character is there, if he dons a red suit or a blue leotard, he can still be the character. It isn't the name or the suit that makes the man.

Of course, it might be a little more difficult if he dons a blue leotard. .

Maybe, but I disagree.

Like I said, how does a man in the real world gain super powers by nuclear energy?

There's a missing factor here that could (should) be affected by Phil's concious decision to stop being Solar.

Because (hopefully) the writing will be good, and the character will still be the same. You mean to tell me that if Sting changed his "codename" to something else, you suddenly wouldn't care about the Harbingers anymore?

If Sting was called the Harbinger I wouldn't care as I think the name fits, but Sting's power and being doesn't depend on what his code name is.

Phil's entire existance does.

Again, tight continuity doesn't have to mean EVERYTHING IS EXACTLY THE SAME! You can have tight continuity starting fresh - keeping continuiting with the currently written comics. You can have tight continuity and still change things, such as character names and/or costumes.

Chris

No, actually that's exactly what it means, that the stories are still there the same way they happened, otherwise it wouldn't be tight continuity, it be selective continuity.

Writer: "Um, can I change where the reactor was from Muskogee to New York so it's cooler?"

Editor: "Sure, why not?"

Names and costumes aren't the only thing that makes the stories good, if it was then VH 2 wouldn't have failed, VH 3 wouldn't have failed, and VH 4 wouldn't have been aborted before birth.

Christopher Priest's and DnA's Shadowman had GREAT writing, it doesn't mean that it was the Shadowman people wanted to read about or cared for.

[ManofTheAtom]

The answer has to be a definite no, which would force him to return to his id.

Why?

Chris

Again?

Becuase Phil grew up reading Doctor Solar comics and built a reactor hoping it would blow up and transform him into his childhood hero.

That sort of thing doesn't happen in the real world, there was an X factor involved, a factor that would be affected if Phil walked away from it.

[ManofTheAtom]

You are right, he could be wrong, but you are assuming he HAS to be wrong. As you stated, he HAS TO STAY SOLAR, which is your assumption, but it doesn't mean it is has to be that way.

Of course he'd be wrong as the wish he made was to become Solar, not Sunstroke.

The only way a new id would work is if he got a new origin after discovering what that X-Factor was and altered it so it would fit the new identity, and that's *SQUEE*.

I don't want to read the Sunstroke comic, I want to read Solar.

I agree, an interesting story line would be delving more into HOW Solar/Phil got his powers. But you seem to think that answer to the above questions HAS to be yes, while it doesn't.

Chris

Sure it does. If it were no then Phil could permanently be someone other than Solar, and I didn't wait 10 years to read something other than Solar, that's what DC and Marvel are for.

VALIANT is where you find the Solar and Magnus comics.

[ManofTheAtom]

How can that be possible when in the VALIANT Universe Iron Man is a comic book character?

Umm...in the VALIANT Universe, Solar is ALSO a comic book character. Phil looked at some Solar comics.

Chris

Right, and he created a version of that character who was aware of his comic book origins.

That's not the case with Iron Man, who was the actual character from Marvel's comics, not something that someone else from the VU created.

[ManofTheAtom]

[dave]

let's please not go down the dc lite road again...

i honestly have to say that i don't connect the same dots to bring me to the place where i would naturally assume that if phil decided not to call himself solar or wera the red suit that he would automatically lose his powers. i COULD see it happening, but i wouldn't assume that it was the most logical outcome of that decision...honestly, what if phil went into a comic store and was told that alan moore was the greatest writer, and phil read watchmen and decided he'd like to be more like dr manhatten or even the owl or rorshach? (he is a bit nuts)...or what if he read a spiderman book? let's say he and gayle get into an argument, and she says that he is far too serious all the time, and refuses to just have fun with her-he reads spiderman, and decides that to try to please her he wants to start using playful banter as he battle evil-doers.

these are comical suggestions of course, but they ring true in the sense that from time to time we as humans try to reinvent ourselves, or try tio improve, change, grow etc...evolve-but it doesn't change who we are...

i don't think it's a good idea to explore the wish idea any further either-it's far better to leave that up to speculatin because, no matter how you try to explain that the theories WILL ALWAYS break down-because as we all know-people cannot fly around, or simply change things at an atomic level and all this-so the science that we like to pride valiant for having, we do give a free pass to them on some things-because there really is not a way to explain these characters in the real world...(although bloodshot could maybe one day exist in some form...)

[cjv]

MOTA,

You keep insisting that it is the SOLAR identity that gives Phil his powers. The comics have never stated that, it is an assumption on your part.

You could just as easily say that his powers were "granted" by his desire to be a superhero (any superhero) and it was simply the fact that he read Solar comics that made him choose Solar (since his powers so obviously AREN'T identical to Solars).

You could just as easily ascribe some other factor to him gaining powers, and it was pure coincidence that he (as opposed to someone else) got the powers.

The fact the Erica ALSO got powers shows that it is not inherently tied to being Solar. She got the same exact powers as him, but she has no Solar-wish.

Maybe his power DOES derive from specifically him wanting to be Solar (even though he is completely different). That would be an interesting story. But it doesn't HAVE to be that way.

Like I said, how does a man in the real world gain super powers by nuclear energy?

There's a missing factor here that could (should) be affected by Phil's concious decision to stop being Solar.

That's as much as a "you have a point" as I have ever seen from you.

Yes, the missing factor COULD be Phil's conscious desire to be Solar, and in that case if he no longer wants to be Solar, there could be ramifications. You think that it SHOULD be that way....but it doesn't HAVE to be.

In the real world, no matter how much someone wants to be a superhero, a nuclear reactor explosion will still kill them. So obviously there is already something separating the Valiant world from ours, and it could be any number of things - ONE explanation of which could include Phil's desire to be Solar.

Again?

Becuase Phil grew up reading Doctor Solar comics and built a reactor hoping it would blow up and transform him into his childhood hero.

That sort of thing doesn't happen in the real world, there was an X factor involve, a factor that would be affected if Phil walked away from it.

Again, the X-factor COULD be Phil's desire to be Solar, it doesn't HAVE to be.

Of course he'd be wrong as the wish he made was to become Solar, not Sunstroke.

The only way a new id would work is if he got a new origin after discovering what that X-Factor was and altered it so it would fit the new identity, and that's *SQUEE*.

Again, the X-factor COULD be Phil's desire to be Solar, it doesn't HAVE to be.

I actually don't want to see a new costumed "Phil Seleksi" character. IMO, the whole reason for Phil adoption the Solar identity was specifically because he read Solar comics. If he discards that, and adopts a new identity, he is becoming much more like a "superhero" than he always seemed to be. He seems to be adopting the mentaility "I have super powers, I must have a costume and a code name" as opposed to being inspired by his childhood comicbook idol.

Instead, I would prefer to see him completely dropping a costumted identity and codename. To me, that we seem more in line with a "maturing" that we might see as someone realizes the world ISN'T a comic book. Yeah, I realize it would be incredibly hard to market and implement, but I think it would be a good direction to go.

No, actually that's exactly what it means, that the stories are still there the same way they happened, otherwise it wouldn't be tight continuity, it be selective continuity.

Writer: "Um, can I chance where the reactor was from Muskogee to New York's three mile island so it's cooler?"

Editor: "Sure, why not?"

Names and costumes aren't the only thing that makes the stories good, if it was then VH 2 wouldn't have failed, VH 3 wouldn't have failed, and VH 4 wouldn't have been aborted before birth.

Christopher Priest's and DnA's Shadowman had GREAT writing, it doesn't mean that it was the Shadowman people wanted to read about or cared for.

You are confusing tight continuity with a continuous story line. There is a difference. And, in fact, you can have a continuous story line WITHOUT tight continuity. I am not going to rehash the difference, because you don't seem to get it. ONE aspect of tight contuity could be to keep the exact same story lines, history, characters, etc as VH1. However, if you don't, you can still have tight continuity within the new storylines - and IMO that is what most people talk about when they say they want tight continuity.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

let's please not go down the dc lite road again...

i honestly have to say that i don't connect the same dots to bring me to the place where i would naturally assume that if phil decided not to call himself solar or wera the red suit that he would automatically lose his powers. i COULD see it happening, but i wouldn't assume that it was the most logical outcome of that decision...honestly, what if phil went into a comic store and was told that alan moore was the greatest writer, and phil read watchmen and decided he'd like to be more like dr manhatten or even the owl or rorshach? (he is a bit nuts)...or what if he read a spiderman book? let's say he and gayle get into an argument, and she says that he is far too serious all the time, and refuses to just have fun with her-he reads spiderman, and decides that to try to please her he wants to start using playful banter as he battle evil-doers.

these are comical suggestions of course, but they ring true in the sense that from time to time we as humans try to reinvent ourselves, or try tio improve, change, grow etc...evolve-but it doesn't change who we are...

i don't think it's a good idea to explore the wish idea any further either-it's far better to leave that up to speculatin because, no matter how you try to explain that the theories WILL ALWAYS break down-because as we all know-people cannot fly around, or simply change things at an atomic level and all this-so the science that we like to pride VALIANT for having, we do give a free pass to them on some things-because there really is not a way to explain these characters in the real world...(although bloodshot could maybe one day exist in some form...)

I do agree that sometimes knowing too much is bad (i.e. Lost and the Others) because it can ruin a mystery, but sometimes it can be good (hmm... now would be a good time for an example of that. You got any?).

[cjv]

I do agree that sometimes knowing too much is bad (i.e. Lost and the Others) because it can ruin a mystery, but sometimes it can be good (hmm... now would be a good time for an example of that. You got any?).

Pulp Fiction and Memento.

Chris

[dave]

you take just about any horror/slash movie, and you find the fear of what the creature/bad guy MIGHT be is always worse than what it actually turns out to be-the best moments of suspense come in wondering what it's going to be/do...

take wolverine-his origin is never going to be told once and for all-the intrigue angle is always going to be played up...and whether his suit is brown and yellow or blue and yellow, or even if he's just dressed as logan, he's a tough guy with anger management issues and a healing factor-everything else is pretty open to interpretation...