Spider-man: One More Day. Thoughts?

rictor · Post by **rictor** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:46 pm

I too, noticed a real drop in the quality of the issue. Reading that JMS wasn't pleased with what he had to write makes a lot of sense.

stone384 · Post by **stone384** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:12 pm

http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/12/04/jm ... #more-6323

m

superman-prime · Post by **superman-prime** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:42 pm

i will finish bnd and then im done with asm for a LONG time

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:12 pm

stone384 wrote:http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/12/04/jm ... #more-6323

m

Thanks. Being a writer with a pretty commanding editor I can 100% sympathize with him. Glad to see he's got a healthy attitude about it.

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:32 pm

Well, it's official...

...no more Spider-Man for me. Man, that was a hellish last issue. I will say that Joe Q's art looked best in this issue, but pretty art doesn't make up for what he did to the overall Spider-Man mythos.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:54 pm

SPOILERS

Read the last part. It should make those who didn't like JMS' run happy since, as far as I can tell, none of it ever happened. If you don't want these character to grow and move forward, you got your wish in spades.

And this is NOT the way Marvel normally deals with continuity. It's like Spiderman woke up in the DC Universe. DC will do something like this every couple years (hell, if you count retconning major chunks of history away without big in-story explainations they do this sort of thing every few months). Can't wait to see which writer now has to explain what Peter's relationship with Iron Man, the Avengers, Civil War, etc is. Having sat though way too many "this is what counts in continuity now" stories at DC I can tell you they rank somewhere between watching toast burn and getting teeth pulled on the fun meter.

Oh and can anyone tell what the flying ***k happened at the end? Why is Harry alive? Why is Peter living with Aunt May and riding a bike? Why is there no indication of May knowing Peter's ID in both this story and the Free Comic Book Day one? (Actually in FCBD ASM she said something that would've made NO sense if she knew Pete was Spidey) Is he still an unregistered criminal?

And putting all those quotes in the back about how great JMS' run was and reprinting the wedding just seemed distasteful after a story that seems to wipe both out.

Glad I'm dropping the book. I LOVED JMS' run and I have a lot of good comics to show for it. Everyone else can have fun with Brand New Day and "Weapon MJ" if that's your cup of tea.

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:24 pm

I havent finished it and am just about to read part four but im going to guess its a load of old cock !!

You just dont need a dumbass gimick to sell the most recognized face on the planet.

You just need to tell a good story.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:59 pm

Jay Tomio wrote:I was hoping what I was reading was a just a rumor leak intended to get buzz working - they actually went through with the Mephisto/Spidey/MJ scenario?

Yeah.

Not sure what in the past 25-30 years is still intact after Mephisto resets reality. It definately looks like JMS' entire run is gone at the very least. You can read the spoilers in my above to see how unbelievably dramatic a change it is.

However, having time to think about it, I can take a step back and see too posibilities here:

a) It is exaclty what it looks like and they just made the most bizarre, contradictory, complicated and out of left field narrative decision ever.

b) It's a fake out. "Brand New Day" will really be a Age of Apocolypse, Heroes Reborn, Deathmate, Emperor Joker, House of M type of story. It's really an alternate reality/illusion Peter wakes up in. It's a trick of Mephisto's that Peter and MJ have to figure there way out of to get back to the real world.

I mean would Mephisto really have the power to really alter reality THAT much (for God's sake the dead are alive here!) and do the creators really want to spend time explaining away how events everyone just read never happened? Option "b" is the only thing that makes sense but who knows if that's the real answer.

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:03 pm

Sounds appalling.

Do Marvel really care so little?

Cyberstrike · Post by **Cyberstrike** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:23 pm

Draco wrote:Sounds appalling.

Do Marvel really care so little?

The amsnwer is: yes.

They "killed" Steve Rogers then bring his LONG dead side kick back from
the grave to be the new Captain America and they turned Iron Man into a jerk.

The Harbinger · Post by **The Harbinger** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:30 pm

marvel sucks

Cyberstrike · Post by **Cyberstrike** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:33 pm

The Harbinger wrote:marvel sucks

So does DC.

stone384 · Post by **stone384** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 9:15 pm

I normally don't read spoilers. I always prefer to read the story in the book/comic/movie. But this was so bad I read them just so I can avoid the last two issues of this storyline. A shame really. There were some really good story elements early on, but to reset everything to way it was 20 years ago is ridiculous.

m

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:13 pm

Like I said, I don't have a problem with it if it's just an alternate timeline they've created for one plotline, you know "Brand New Day" turns out to basically be "Age of Mephisto."

But it's hard to say at this point. All the Spiderman appearances I'm aware of outside the Spidey books currently still have him in the black costume so clearly those stories happen before OMD.

If Brand New Day Spiderman does pop up in the Avengers, and this is a real change, there is going to a whole lot of 'splaining to do...

superman-prime · Post by **superman-prime** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:58 am

No more asm for me, and im thinking about dropping both avengers titles as well, marvel is ruining this stuff for me. back to dc for a long time then, BRING ON NEW VALIANT.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 10:15 am

Cyberstrike wrote:
Draco wrote:Sounds appalling.

Do Marvel really care so little?

The amsnwer is: yes.

They "killed" Steve Rogers then bring his LONG dead side kick back from
the grave to be the new Captain America and they turned Iron Man into a jerk.

Don't you mean they brought back his LONG dead side kick and then 25 issues later, killed Steve Rogers?

I like Iron Man, myself. He's stepped up to the plate when no one else would and he's done some awesome things as the head of SHIELD/The Initiative in Captain America, World War Hulk. etc. Personally I wish all the heroes in the Marvel Universe would stop blaming everything on Tony (I think we've got a few monthes before everyone gets that stuff out their system).

Cyberstrike · Post by **Cyberstrike** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 10:58 am

Todd Luck wrote:
Cyberstrike wrote:
Draco wrote:Sounds appalling.

Do Marvel really care so little?

The amsnwer is: yes.

They "killed" Steve Rogers then bring his LONG dead side kick back from
the grave to be the new Captain America and they turned Iron Man into a jerk.
Don't you mean they brought back his LONG dead side kick and then 25 issues later, killed Steve Rogers?

I like Iron Man, myself. He's stepped up to the plate when no one else would and he's done some awesome things as the head of SHIELD/The Initiative in Captain America, World War Hulk. etc. Personally I wish all the heroes in the Marvel Universe would stop blaming everything on Tony (I think we've got a few monthes before everyone gets that stuff out their system).

Honestly I don't why but characters like Iron Man/Tony Stark and Batman/Bruce Wayne annoy me to no end.
I liked Stark more before the Civil War when he acted more human and now he comes off to me as a self-rightous prick and Batman was has always been a bit of self-rightous prick

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:34 pm

Cyberstrike wrote:
Todd Luck wrote:
Cyberstrike wrote:
Draco wrote:Sounds appalling.

Do Marvel really care so little?

The amsnwer is: yes.

They "killed" Steve Rogers then bring his LONG dead side kick back from
the grave to be the new Captain America and they turned Iron Man into a jerk.
Don't you mean they brought back his LONG dead side kick and then 25 issues later, killed Steve Rogers?

I like Iron Man, myself. He's stepped up to the plate when no one else would and he's done some awesome things as the head of SHIELD/The Initiative in Captain America, World War Hulk. etc. Personally I wish all the heroes in the Marvel Universe would stop blaming everything on Tony (I think we've got a few monthes before everyone gets that stuff out their system).
Honestly I don't why but characters like Iron Man/Tony Stark and Batman/Bruce Wayne annoy me to no end.
I liked Stark more before the Civil War when he acted more human and now he comes off to me as a self-rightous prick and Batman was has always been a bit of self-rightous prick

Try reading Captain America. Tony doesn't get much more human (plus it's cool that Cap charged Tony with carrying out his final requests).

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 3:50 pm

Cyberstrike wrote:Honestly I don't why but characters like Iron Man/Tony Stark and Batman/Bruce Wayne annoy me to no end.
I liked Stark more before the Civil War when he acted more human and now he comes off to me as a self-rightous prick and Batman was has always been a bit of self-rightous prick

I've thought about Bruce for quite some time now. I wish they would tone him down just a tad. I know he's supposed to be somewhat of a dark loner, but I miss that bond/friendship he used to have with Superman. Now he almost comes across like Frank Castle.

Drift · Post by **Drift** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 4:52 am

I personally thought it was well written but that doesn't make it good.
The idea of Mephisto approaching them is really cool and it was really dark but just not that interesting. Another example of why Joey Q should only be editing his bowel movements and not comics ecause he isn't that great. I think he is just in it for the limelight and nothing else. Why else would he costantly do the stories nobody else has ever been allowed to touch? Origin anyone? Brilliant story, totally unneccessary.

OMD was an interesting idea but was poorly executed especially after the arc with Spidey kicking the living snot out of the Kingpin and telling him to fix it, oh no wait that didn't happen now so we won't get a follow up to that. Also the Scarlet Spiders saying PP wasn't the only spiderman and was just chosen as a public face in Avengers: The Initiative a few months ago was really cool and well done essentially giving him back his identity and his life, now rendered moot. Why Joey Q? Why? all the good work done by others and undone by your own pretentiousness. How is Spidey going to fit with the rest of continuity?

This would have massive repercussions on the rest of the MU unless they remove Spidey from mainstream MU continuity. They have put themselves in a lose/lose situation: cop out or lose out.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:10 pm

Well assuming these changes are real, I don't think it's ego or lack of caring or anything on Joe Q's part. Just taking what he says on face value, he just believes Spidey's lost a lot of things over the years which he believes are vital to the character and to Spidey's appeal to new readers. Now obviously a large vocal group of fans (including myself) and writers (JMS, etc) disagree. Spidey's Marvel's biggest franchise so oviously there's going to be more pull on it from the people at the top like Joe and more concern with how it's playing with the general public.

And sometimes fans and the powers that be just don't see eye to eye. I don't agree with the direction the DCU just went in. I didn't agree with where both companies took their characters in the 90's. I don't agree with the end of OMD mainly because it just turned Spidey into "DC Lite" if it's real. LOL

But looking beyond face value, we also don't know what overall sales figues, survey numbers and focus groups Joe's looking at and if there's any pressure from the people above him (like I said, it is the company's biggest franchise). Plus he may be taking sole credit for EVERYTHING involved to take the backlash heat off writers/editors involved in BND.

But other than Joe's occasional micro-management of the Spidey titles, I've really enjoyed Marvel in the last few years. This is definately the best bunch of comics they've put since that tall guy was EIC in the 80's

Still not convinced that BND won't just turn out to be the Spidey version of "Age of Apocolypse."

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:24 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:
Cyberstrike wrote:Honestly I don't why but characters like Iron Man/Tony Stark and Batman/Bruce Wayne annoy me to no end.
I liked Stark more before the Civil War when he acted more human and now he comes off to me as a self-rightous prick and Batman was has always been a bit of self-rightous prick
I've thought about Bruce for quite some time now. I wish they would tone him down just a tad. I know he's supposed to be somewhat of a dark loner, but I miss that bond/friendship he used to have with Superman. Now he almost comes across like Frank Castle.

I thought they already did that with Superman. Morrison made Supes the only guy in the League Bats liked (at least at first) during his run and according to JLA 0 he appearantly secretly hangs out with Wonder Woman and Supes a lot. Both of which seem wierd to me but most of my knowledge of these characters from the 80's/90's has retconned and rebooted away.

tarheelmarine · Post by **tarheelmarine** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 2:42 pm

Todd Luck wrote:
Daniel Jackson wrote:
Cyberstrike wrote:Honestly I don't why but characters like Iron Man/Tony Stark and Batman/Bruce Wayne annoy me to no end.
I liked Stark more before the Civil War when he acted more human and now he comes off to me as a self-rightous prick and Batman was has always been a bit of self-rightous prick
I've thought about Bruce for quite some time now. I wish they would tone him down just a tad. I know he's supposed to be somewhat of a dark loner, but I miss that bond/friendship he used to have with Superman. Now he almost comes across like Frank Castle.
I thought they already did that with Superman. Morrison made Supes the only guy in the League Bats liked (at least at first) during his run and according to JLA 0 he appearantly secretly hangs out with Wonder Woman and Supes a lot. Both of which seem wierd to me but most of my knowledge of these characters from the 80's/90's has retconned and rebooted away.

Trinity was a great miniseries that approaches the characters in the way you both seem to like them.

Draco · Post by **Draco** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 7:38 pm

Ever since marvel attempted to appoint top writers to their line of books in the early 2000's the one i was most unsure about was JMS.

I have found 80% of his run to nothing short of bland.

The civil war stuff was great but then i genuinely found most of civil war to be really cool after initially thinking it was another dumb crossover for extra sales.

Sure Marvel probably thought they would get some attention with such a massive story but it even they didnt realize it would actually be a good read

So now Marvel have gone and shown us once again how $$ rules and everything is else is not important.

Stupid stupid stupid.

I care little

Make mine Valiant ( with a little mix from everyone else for good measure)

happy new year to all

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:46 am

Draco wrote:Ever since marvel attempted to appoint top writers to their line of books in the early 2000's the one i was most unsure about was JMS.

I have found 80% of his run to nothing short of bland.

The civil war stuff was great but then i genuinely found most of civil war to be really cool after initially thinking it was another dumb crossover for extra sales.

Sure Marvel probably thought they would get some attention with such a massive story but it even they didnt realize it would actually be a good read

So now Marvel have gone and shown us once again how $$ rules and everything is else is not important.

What's $$ ruling got to do with it? I can't imagine how they DON'T lose money off of this. Filling in the blanks on backstory is one of the main drving forces on selling recently published tradepaperbacks (I would think). They've killed that dead since none of the trades of JMS's run (and a whole lot of other things) are part of Spidey's history anymore.

I don't think this is really that big a reflection on Marvel as a company. What happens in Spidey doesn't lessen my enjoyment of Captain America, Thor, X-Men First Class, etc. Spidey is just one title and I was going to drop it anyway after JMS left, so I don't care too much. Just wish the send off had been better.

BTW, here's an interesting Joe Q interview on One More Day...

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/ ... i?id=12673