Spider-man: One More Day. Thoughts?

[etos45]

BTW, here's an interesting Joe Q interview on One More Day...

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/ ... i?id=12673

That was a pretty good read, thanks.

One thing I didn't quite understand about Quesada's interview was that he said the reason why they didn't use JMS's original concept for the last two issues is that it would have reset 30 years or Amazing Spider-man and put the Marvel Universe is a "Crisis".

...but didn't they do that anyways? I mean, MJ has totally been erased from the series which alters everything from the past because she's in just about every issue, helping him make decisions and what not. On top of that, no one knows his secret identity now which nulls out most of Civil War since that was such a big plot point. Peter's been pushed back 20 years, so where does that leave current continuity? Throw on top of that that Harry is apparently going to be brought back and you've got a dandy mess in the Universe. Makes me curious what in JMS's story idea could have possibly messed it up more.

That being said, I'm not going to quit reading. Unfortunately being a Spider-man fan mean sifting through a lot of crap storylines. This is just one of them. When the Clone Saga happened and they told me the Spider-man I grew up reading was a clone, I quit reading (quit all things comics, I was so *SQUEE*) but then BAM just kidding... and they'll do the same thing here.

My 2cents...

[Draco]

Ever since marvel attempted to appoint top writers to their line of books in the early 2000's the one i was most unsure about was JMS.

I have found 80% of his run to nothing short of bland.

The civil war stuff was great but then i genuinely found most of civil war to be really cool after initially thinking it was another dumb crossover for extra sales.

Sure Marvel probably thought they would get some attention with such a massive story but it even they didnt realize it would actually be a good read


So now Marvel have gone and shown us once again how $$ rules and everything is else is not important.

What's $$ ruling got to do with it? I can't imagine how they DON'T lose money off of this.



Well i cant imagine Marvel doing anything short of counting the extra dollars in the bank after this dross !!


They put out more issues of amazing instead of Friendly & sensational which is the best seller and theres more revenue straight off.

Plus all the hype means they sell twice as much off the bat too.

This is what i mean with more interested in $$$$.

They did not need to pull this nonsense as what had happened of recent was pretty cool all things considered.

They decided that they needed more sales and screw the customers we'll do whatever it takes to double triple our sales.

Does anyone think they did this for the fans.

NONSENSE !!

Of course they are a business who's job it is to make money and increase sales so it makes sense but the people who give them the money are not considered.

my

[Todd Luck]

BTW, here's an interesting Joe Q interview on One More Day...

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/ ... i?id=12673

That was a pretty good read, thanks.

One thing I didn't quite understand about Quesada's interview was that he said the reason why they didn't use JMS's original concept for the last two issues is that it would have reset 30 years or Amazing Spider-man and put the Marvel Universe is a "Crisis".

...but didn't they do that anyways? I mean, MJ has totally been erased from the series which alters everything from the past because she's in just about every issue, helping him make decisions and what not. On top of that, no one knows his secret identity now which nulls out most of Civil War since that was such a big plot point. Peter's been pushed back 20 years, so where does that leave current continuity? Throw on top of that that Harry is apparently going to be brought back and you've got a dandy mess in the Universe. Makes me curious what in JMS's story idea could have possibly messed it up more.

That's one of my questions too. However Mary Jane is still in the book and still in Peter's social circle, Harry's already back in the last issue of OMD and A LOT more was changed than just him not revealing his ID, which is the problem (I'm actually not aware of anything other than that one scene in civil war and events in the Spiderman titles that would be effect by him not revealing his ID). What Spidey's history is at the moment is anyone's guess.

[Todd Luck]

Ever since marvel attempted to appoint top writers to their line of books in the early 2000's the one i was most unsure about was JMS.

I have found 80% of his run to nothing short of bland.

The civil war stuff was great but then i genuinely found most of civil war to be really cool after initially thinking it was another dumb crossover for extra sales.

Sure Marvel probably thought they would get some attention with such a massive story but it even they didnt realize it would actually be a good read


So now Marvel have gone and shown us once again how $$ rules and everything is else is not important.

What's $$ ruling got to do with it? I can't imagine how they DON'T lose money off of this.



Well i cant imagine Marvel doing anything short of counting the extra dollars in the bank after this dross !!


They put out more issues of amazing instead of Friendly & sensational which is the best seller and theres more revenue straight off.

Plus all the hype means they sell twice as much off the bat too.

This is what i mean with more interested in $$$$.

They did not need to pull this nonsense as what had happened of recent was pretty cool all things considered.

They decided that they needed more sales and screw the customers we'll do whatever it takes to double triple our sales.

Does anyone think they did this for the fans.

NONSENSE !!

Of course they are a business who's job it is to make money and increase sales so it makes sense but the people who give them the money are not considered.

my

Didn't say they weren't for profit company or that this plotline wouldn't get relatively good single issue sales (which ain't much in the grand scheme of things) but they're sacrificing many years worth of tradepaperback sales and probably new issue sales as well. But who knows? Maybe they're looking at survey numbers that told them everyone who liked JMS' run was going to stop reading when he left anyway and that a tradepaperback's sales are somehow magically disconnected form its importance to a series.

[Draco]

I genuinely think this has harmed spidey long term more than anything i can remember of before.

Marvel do make some good comics but overall they SUCK !!!

[superman-prime]

spiderman = crap now

[Escaflown4]

I just read the synopsis over at Newsrama and all I got to say is this...

Congrats Joey Q....you just destroyed Marvel's top icon...over 20 years of work flushed down the toilet. Why they appointed him as EIC is beyond my comprehension. This is by far worse then killing Superman. From the response alone, looks like more then 50% of the readers are dropping the title. It'll take a miracle to get Spidey back up there again.

[Todd Luck]

I will say this:

I don't think it's really possible to form an opinion on it without reading the actual issue. Hell I don't think you can really form a good opinion on this without reading the beginning of Brand New Day. Personally I'm leaving my half formed "this is a sucky ending but I have no idea what it means for the future" opinion since BND didn't appeal to me before I knew about the reboot (the caliber of writing needed for the series just wasn't there in AMS FCBD issue).

Still not entirely convinced it's a real reboot. I bounce between "it's a reboot" and "it's an alternate story" on a daily basis.

I know Joe Q keeps talking like it's the real deal but why not do a clean reboot? Why leave a huge "to be continued" subplot from of the old continuity that'll be dealt with in BND? I'm speaking of the fact that MJ is still in the supporting cast and that she makes an offer to Mephisto that he accepts but we (the reader) never find out what it is. Judging from what she says to Pete right before the reboot, she thinks she can outsmart Mephisto and they'll still end up together. That's just an odd way to begin an "Unmarried Spidey" reboot.

And why put a "Who's Who" entry on Aunt May's history (previous issues had entires on Peter, MJ and Mephisto) in the back? You've got 1000's of words detailing her past right in the back of a comic that just wiped out half of it. Makes no sense.

MJ becoming a superhero. Harry's now alive. Pete living with Aunt May and riding a bike. And, as far as I can tell, he has no fugative status. It just feels like too much to be a real reboot and not an "Age of Apocolypse" type of story.

[Escaflown4]

I will say this:

I don't think it's really possible to form an opinion on it without reading the actual issue. Hell I don't think you can really form a good opinion on this without reading the beginning of Brand New Day. Personally I'm leaving my half formed "this is a sucky ending but I have no idea what it means for the future" opinion since BND didn't appeal to me before I knew about the reboot (the caliber of writing needed for the series just wasn't there in AMS FCBD issue).

Still not entirely convinced it's a real reboot. I bounce between "it's a reboot" and "it's an alternate story" on a daily basis.

I know Joe Q keeps talking like it's the real deal but why not do a clean reboot? Why leave a huge "to be continued" subplot from of the old continuity that'll be dealt with in BND? I'm speaking of the fact that MJ is still in the supporting cast and that she makes an offer to Mephisto that he accepts but we (the reader) never find out what it is. Judging from what she says to Pete right before the reboot, she thinks she can outsmart Mephisto and they'll still end up together. That's just an odd way to begin an "Unmarried Spidey" reboot.

And why put a "Who's Who" entry on Aunt May's history (previous issues had entires on Peter, MJ and Mephisto) in the back? You've got 1000's of words detailing her past right in the back of a comic that just wiped out half of it. Makes no sense.

MJ becoming a superhero. Harry's now alive. Pete living with Aunt May and riding a bike. And, as far as I can tell, he has no fugative status. It just feels like too much to be a real reboot and not an "Age of Apocolypse" type of story.

Even if this is not a real reboot, I can't see how this storyline will help the title. A lot of people have already had it and dumped Spidey with One More Day. The story itself is even worse then the Clone Saga. ASM have not had any solid writing for as long as I can remember.

I said it once and I'll say it again....the day they revealed Spidey's identity to public in Civil War was the day they destroyed the character. So I wouldn't be surprised at all if this was a real reboot....Joey Q could after all be looking for an easy way out of his mistake.

[Todd Luck]

I will say this:

I don't think it's really possible to form an opinion on it without reading the actual issue. Hell I don't think you can really form a good opinion on this without reading the beginning of Brand New Day. Personally I'm leaving my half formed "this is a sucky ending but I have no idea what it means for the future" opinion since BND didn't appeal to me before I knew about the reboot (the caliber of writing needed for the series just wasn't there in AMS FCBD issue).

Still not entirely convinced it's a real reboot. I bounce between "it's a reboot" and "it's an alternate story" on a daily basis.

I know Joe Q keeps talking like it's the real deal but why not do a clean reboot? Why leave a huge "to be continued" subplot from of the old continuity that'll be dealt with in BND? I'm speaking of the fact that MJ is still in the supporting cast and that she makes an offer to Mephisto that he accepts but we (the reader) never find out what it is. Judging from what she says to Pete right before the reboot, she thinks she can outsmart Mephisto and they'll still end up together. That's just an odd way to begin an "Unmarried Spidey" reboot.

And why put a "Who's Who" entry on Aunt May's history (previous issues had entires on Peter, MJ and Mephisto) in the back? You've got 1000's of words detailing her past right in the back of a comic that just wiped out half of it. Makes no sense.

MJ becoming a superhero. Harry's now alive. Pete living with Aunt May and riding a bike. And, as far as I can tell, he has no fugative status. It just feels like too much to be a real reboot and not an "Age of Apocolypse" type of story.

Even if this is not a real reboot, I can't see how this storyline will help the title. A lot of people have already had it and dumped Spidey with One More Day. The story itself is even worse then the Clone Saga. ASM have not had any solid writing for as long as I can remember.

That's another thing I don't get. Seems like someone should be happy over this. There are tons of people who complain to high heaven about JMS' run or at least parts of it. If this is real reboot everything in his run, every single thing that anyone could complain about is gone. This is practically what people who have hated the recent comics have been asking for.

Trust me, if you hate JMS' stuff, Brand New Day is the polar opposite of it in every way (which is why I'm steering clear of it)

[Escaflown4]

I will say this:

I don't think it's really possible to form an opinion on it without reading the actual issue. Hell I don't think you can really form a good opinion on this without reading the beginning of Brand New Day. Personally I'm leaving my half formed "this is a sucky ending but I have no idea what it means for the future" opinion since BND didn't appeal to me before I knew about the reboot (the caliber of writing needed for the series just wasn't there in AMS FCBD issue).

Still not entirely convinced it's a real reboot. I bounce between "it's a reboot" and "it's an alternate story" on a daily basis.

I know Joe Q keeps talking like it's the real deal but why not do a clean reboot? Why leave a huge "to be continued" subplot from of the old continuity that'll be dealt with in BND? I'm speaking of the fact that MJ is still in the supporting cast and that she makes an offer to Mephisto that he accepts but we (the reader) never find out what it is. Judging from what she says to Pete right before the reboot, she thinks she can outsmart Mephisto and they'll still end up together. That's just an odd way to begin an "Unmarried Spidey" reboot.

And why put a "Who's Who" entry on Aunt May's history (previous issues had entires on Peter, MJ and Mephisto) in the back? You've got 1000's of words detailing her past right in the back of a comic that just wiped out half of it. Makes no sense.

MJ becoming a superhero. Harry's now alive. Pete living with Aunt May and riding a bike. And, as far as I can tell, he has no fugative status. It just feels like too much to be a real reboot and not an "Age of Apocolypse" type of story.

Even if this is not a real reboot, I can't see how this storyline will help the title. A lot of people have already had it and dumped Spidey with One More Day. The story itself is even worse then the Clone Saga. ASM have not had any solid writing for as long as I can remember.

That's another thing I don't get. Seems like someone should be happy over this. There are tons of people who complain to high heaven about JMS' run or at least parts of it. If this is real reboot everything in his run, every single thing that anyone could complain about is gone. This is practically what people who have hated the recent comics have been asking for.

Trust me, if you hate JMS' stuff, Brand New Day is the polar opposite of it in every way (which is why I'm steering clear of it)

Yea I'm not a big fan of the JMS run myself. I dropped ASM right after the storyline involving the twins. Still....having a reboot reset back to the bronze age is not my idea of a good solution.

[Dr. Solar]

When I read a spoiler of what happened on another board, my first thought was, "Nice one. No, really. What happened?"

I guess some other people thought that too, until someone wrote, "No. really."

I've never been a big Spider-Man fan, I've read it here and there, but don't have any real ties to the character. This is just silly though, and makes me want to read Spider-Man even less.

I am usually one to say that it doesn't matter, as long as it is good stories, but this is just dumb.

[Draco]

Is this just another Age of Apocalypse style event?

Is it House of M with some similar changes made when its all over that make sense and can last through the next ten years continuity.

I wish

If Marvel were being clever here and intending to end this story with things back to normal, outwitting Mephisto and Aunt may all ok too then fair enough.

Hardly likely.

Marvel can pretty much change whatever they like between pre & post House of M.

Surely a good thing.

In a way i kind of like it that way as long as Marvel realize they need to bow to the common requirements set out by the fans.

HAHAHAHAHA !!!

However if this really is their answer to what was considered by many to be a mistake in revealing Spidey's identity then BIG BOOBOO !!!!!

What Civil War did to Spidey was almost a requirement more or less in todays gritty market place where shiney happy superhero comics actually reflect the F****D up world we live in, albeit exaggerated to hell

if you are going to be bold in your approach and you actually tell some good stories doing so, dont go back on it and try to sell the Spider-man from twenty years ago that most of todays Spider-man and comics fans dont even know.

We dont need Spider-man back to 20+ years ago. Although I loved it’s then it not then anymore

They can buy Essentials if they do want it !

Its now today here and it could be worse. It could be the half way point of the clone sage and i only have another 75 issues to get.

A friend and myself worked out around early Quesada and Jemas etc there was a major change in Marvel continuity that was the modern age as we are right here and now. It really needs a name ( aside from modern age)attached for historical reasons ( if not already. anyone?)

In what was roughly a two year period and though not all together, most marvel titles had a revamp although some subtle or non noticeable.

They all changed enough to notice and all suddenly had a similar feel.

The most noticeable event was the return of the retro covers and also the same month as JMS on Amazing Spider-man and not far off Morrison on Xmen etc.

It was a time where i can point to and say this is a jump on point for marvel if anyone wants to try.

Since then theres been some average stuff that passed me by and some poop too but I think Marvel as a whole have produced some really good stuff. If you can set aside lack of continuity between the key books their many spin offs and rest of the Marvel Universe.

House of M means Marvel can stick to the major and more memorable marvel plots of the first forty years and add accordingly after House of m, with the reality warping event mending a few inconsistencies within the Marvel Universe where needed.

I like House of M ( orginally thought it would suck) main series and thought it was a good start afresh. Then i heard it was a precursor to something much bigger and it was prone to change once more before the big finale whatever that could be.

Civil war arrived and was good (95%) but all that has happened is Marvel got some big bucks in the banks and retailers watched their sales percentages on Marvel books Rise steeply.

Did this help long term?

I think not if the books are all over the place again it was a temporary thing and we need it all the time without question.

Marvel dont seem to know how to keep a good thing going, and will continue to pull stunts like Spider-man One more Day and we never gain any ground.

IMO Marvel wont ever get back to pleasing the long term fans as a whole until some rich fans buy out Marvel and listen to the wage payers.

my

[Todd Luck]

Well it gets deeper in the next part of the Joe Q interview...

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/ ... i?id=12681

Okay, I actually could follow what he was describing with how JMS wanted to do the retcon/reboot. If that had been the end of One More Day there would've been an actual stated logical reason for everything to happen, a stopping point for what we know is altered and a bit of story to it.

What Quesada said about what was actually published...I'm not getting it. Ok, so all that happened was the wedding was negated, people forgot Spidey's ID and Harry returned because there's a price when you make a deal with the devil (what in God's name does that mean?). Then why does Pete wake up at Aunt May's house, ride a bike to a party and have his old mechanical webshooter on? Why am I getting zero indication May knows Peter's Spiderman? How is he able to walk around in public with no problem when he's an unregistered fugutive? (even if he didn't go public with his ID, Stark knows who he is). Yeah, me thinks something else happened here.

I suppose we'll go into this in the next couple parts of the interview...

[depluto]

I paid $4 an issue for that? I wish they had just thrown her off a bridge like last time. At least that issue is worth some money.

[Byrneout]

I also don’t buy into the argument that just because "Ultimate Spider-Man" Peter is single that Marvel U Spidey shouldn’t be. I mean Ultimate Spider-Man doesn’t kill, does that mean that I should let Marvel U Spidey start killing his enemies?

I have to say, this "reasoning" has dumbfounded me.

That is all.

[Escaflown4]

I think Marvel needs to remove Joe Q before he takes the rest of Marvel down with him. He better not do anything stupid with the X-Men.

[Todd Luck]

I paid $4 an issue for that? I wish they had just thrown her off a bridge like last time. At least that issue is worth some money.

Throw who off a bridge? I thought the one time MJ "died" it was in a plane explosion. I found one online retailer selling the issue for 4 bucks NM (which seems high to me).

[depluto]

I paid $4 an issue for that? I wish they had just thrown her off a bridge like last time. At least that issue is worth some money.

Throw who off a bridge? I thought the one time MJ "died" it was in a plane explosion. I found one online retailer selling the issue for 4 bucks NM (which seems high to me).

From Joe Q's reasoning from that interview it sounded like the editors had the same concerns as when they axed Gwen (that's the issue I meant, 121) all those years ago. I guess they hate writing for a happy Spidey.

But basically, anytime Mephisto gets involved with Spider-Man I think it's bush.

[Todd Luck]

I paid $4 an issue for that? I wish they had just thrown her off a bridge like last time. At least that issue is worth some money.

Throw who off a bridge? I thought the one time MJ "died" it was in a plane explosion. I found one online retailer selling the issue for 4 bucks NM (which seems high to me).

From Joe Q's reasoning from that interview it sounded like the editors had the same concerns as when they axed Gwen (that's the issue I meant, 121) all those years ago. I guess they hate writing for a happy Spidey.

But basically, anytime Mephisto gets involved with Spider-Man I think it's bush.

It is a very similar reason as to why they killed Gwen. They thought marriage aged the character too much and they didn't want to give up the stories they could get out of Peter being single (the "soap opera" as Joe Q calls it). Though here it sounds like Joe doesn't like the wedding itself (calling it a cheap marketing stunt by Shooter, etc).

Of course here they don't kill MJ (again). She's still in the book, still got a history with Peter (whatever that is now), stilll in his social circle but now she gets to put on a costume and be a superhero. Isn't that so much better? LOL

[depluto]

I guess I can understand some of the reasoning ... not wanting to kill off MJ or explain to kids why Spidey is divorced. But it's still not tied off well.

I think long-time readers are going to feel pretty queasy the first time Pete dry-humps some floozy he met in the supermarket.

[Todd Luck]

I guess I can understand some of the reasoning ... not wanting to kill off MJ or explain to kids why Spidey is divorced. But it's still not tied off well.

I think long-time readers are going to feel pretty queasy the first time Pete dry-humps some floozy he met in the supermarket.

LOL So did you get queezy a lot a few years back during the Peter/MJ seperation? I mean, they already killed her and had them split back in the 90's. Don't recall any media coverage for either event (like Joe Q said he was afriad of). Don't even recall any fan uproar, though there were so many f-ed up things about the Spidey titles at the time I suppose it seemed like a minor thing.


An interesting email from JMS on Newsarama...

http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=141756

[depluto]

It's basically a neutron bomb to the continuity, I guess. Until some future editor drops another bomb and puts everything back the way it was. Since they can do that. Since it's magic and all.

Stan Lee maybe could have got away with this around issue No. 8, but there is so much story there now.

The earlier splits with MJ felt like temporary things; this one has a permanent feel to it. Not from anything in the story, just from Q's statements.

[depluto]

And it sounds like there is way too much micromanagement from the top at Marvel these days. On the other hand, and with the exception of this Spidey stuff, they really are putting out some great comics.

[Todd Luck]

And it sounds like there is way too much micromanagement from the top at Marvel these days. On the other hand, and with the exception of this Spidey stuff, they really are putting out some great comics.

Agreed.

Except for Spidey (specifically Sins Past and One More Day) I'm not aware of Joe Q doing micromanagement on actual stories.

Which is a good thing. I once read something from a comic editor (can't remember who, maybe Shooter?) who said that part of his job was saying "yes" alot and you can tell Joe and the guys under him do a great job of that with all the diverse selection of great comics (Iron Fist, Marvel Zombies, Annihalation, X-Men First Class, Captian America, Punisher, etc, etc)

And it's rarely a good thing when any editor has to get involved in a story after it's been assigned or planned. Speaking from personal experience as a writer (at a newspaper), when the editor makes you change something or rewrites something you wrote, it's a rare thing when that actually turns out anywhere near as good as what you originally were doing. Sometimes it's vitally neccessary but very rarely does an editor's writing style mesh well with the writers under them, especially on rushed last minute corrections. As a reader I enjoyed One More Day right up until the end of issue 3. Somehow you can just tell when someone else has reworked something.