What is Nick Fury's race?

[Dr. Solar]

BTW, Nick Fury is a girl.

You have a strange definition of girl:

[Bone-A-Fach-ee]

BTW, Nick Fury is a girl.

You have a strange definition of girl:

That is one of the greatest panels I've ever seen about Nick Fury. That was rad! Thanks for sharing!

[Elveen]

He's a human.

And again:

I think that's a species and not a race.

As for the rest of the high context conversation all I can say is -ahhhh the age of oversensitivity- The modern idiot's form of manipulation.

Interesting you should say that. I would think dividing people would be a bigger form of manipulation.

People have defining characteristics, there is nothing wrong with noting those. No one would be offended if he was asking "wasn't Nick Fury bald? Now he has hair! WTH?!" But if you mention race, sexuality, etc. people make a big deal.

Now, if you start to judge people based on genetic differences (race, hair color, etc.) then you're a *SQUEE*, but you can't get around the fact that each person looks different, and some groups of people have similar characteristics. Grouping and dividing is natural. My 2 year old groups his trucks. Is he racist against firetrucks? Let's not be silly.

I just thought Euro Imperialism like a week ago in summer school (Including Social Darwinism and the Euros taking over Africa). So of course I have the platform to discuss this very topic.
What I have always said (and what I just said) is that we all make judgements on people based on appearances. I tell the kids.... you see some one at the movies or mall or Tilly's or whatever and based on just appearance you decide..... "hot or not" "cool or fool". I tell the kids they judged me when they first saw me, just like I made judgements on them.....

The issue is that if we let the preconceived judgements effect our actions..... then we might have problems.

The example I ALWAYS use is...... I have students I like better than some. I have favorites. Students have favorite teachers, I have favorite students. BUT...... when it comes to grading their work, I grade blind. I don't grade any differently. Just because an "A" student currently has a high grade does not mean that when I grade their work I glance over it, while a "C" student might get a more careful look.

The racism issue will always be there (I'd imagine, but maybe not). We have to be able to ask questions and talk about "race" issues. Every person and every group of persons (large and small) will have what is offensive to them and allowable. Just this week my wife had the TV on and a rerun of "The View" was on. I happen to look up and saw Whoppi Goldberg say something like, "that's right, it's all Black people up here". All of the host of this episode happened to be black. Is it a problem she said it? what if a white person or asian, or mexican person said it? ("that's right, it's all white people up here" "thats's right it's all mexican people up here") Is it ok? We can't be afraid to talk about these issues.

I teach at a school that is mostly asian (like 65% of the students are asian). I also teach two AP US Hist classes. out of my entire class, I might have 3 non asians in class, maybe. Is it racist for a non-asian to notice this, or mention it, or even more importantly, ....... can we (as a school) talk about why the asians dominate our AP programs while our black and mexican kids do not seem to take these classes?

I use to monitor after school detention to make a little extra scratch. about 65% of our school is asian, but...... do you know what % of asian kids are usually in detention? (take a guess)

There were days in detention that half of the 35-40 kids I had in detention were mexican and black, and they make up like 11-13% of the school population. What does that mean? Can we talk about why? Do asian kids not get in trouble? ........ or do teachers let them "slide" more often than not. Is there a preconceived idea that asian kids are "better" more "respectable", not "trouble" kids so they get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to punishments?

Would it be wrong for the school to form a think tank to address this issue?
Would it be wrong for the school to NOT form a think tank to address this issue?

I guess my bottom line is, we have to be able to ask questions without the fear of some one pulling the race card. I can tell you that as a teacher, it is a BIG concern and worry among my peers.

So back to the original question......

What is Nick Fury's race? I have no idea, I don't' read Marvel books. I know I've seen older pics of him as a old crusty white dude with an eye patch. But I have also seen him as a black dude. So.....

I have no idea, but I don't think there is any problem in asking the question given the two facts listed above.

[nutflush76]

He's a human.

And again:

I think that's a species and not a race.

As for the rest of the high context conversation all I can say is -ahhhh the age of oversensitivity- The modern idiot's form of manipulation.

Interesting you should say that. I would think dividing people would be a bigger form of manipulation.

People have defining characteristics, there is nothing wrong with noting those. No one would be offended if he was asking "wasn't Nick Fury bald? Now he has hair! WTH?!" But if you mention race, sexuality, etc. people make a big deal.

Now, if you start to judge people based on genetic differences (race, hair color, etc.) then you're a *SQUEE*, but you can't get around the fact that each person looks different, and some groups of people have similar characteristics. Grouping and dividing is natural. My 2 year old groups his trucks. Is he racist against firetrucks? Let's not be silly.

I just thought Euro Imperialism like a week ago in summer school (Including Social Darwinism and the Euros taking over Africa). So of course I have the platform to discuss this very topic.
What I have always said (and what I just said) is that we all make judgements on people based on appearances. I tell the kids.... you see some one at the movies or mall or Tilly's or whatever and based on just appearance you decide..... "hot or not" "cool or fool". I tell the kids they judged me when they first saw me, just like I made judgements on them.....

The issue is that if we let the preconceived judgements effect our actions..... then we might have problems.

The example I ALWAYS use is...... I have students I like better than some. I have favorites. Students have favorite teachers, I have favorite students. BUT...... when it comes to grading their work, I grade blind. I don't grade any differently. Just because an "A" student currently has a high grade does not mean that when I grade their work I glance over it, while a "C" student might get a more careful look.

The racism issue will always be there (I'd imagine, but maybe not). We have to be able to ask questions and talk about "race" issues. Every person and every group of persons (large and small) will have what is offensive to them and allowable. Just this week my wife had the TV on and a rerun of "The View" was on. I happen to look up and saw Whoppi Goldberg say something like, "that's right, it's all Black people up here". All of the host of this episode happened to be black. Is it a problem she said it? what if a white person or asian, or mexican person said it? ("that's right, it's all white people up here" "thats's right it's all mexican people up here") Is it ok? We can't be afraid to talk about these issues.

I teach at a school that is mostly asian (like 65% of the students are asian). I also teach two AP US Hist classes. out of my entire class, I might have 3 non asians in class, maybe. Is it racist for a non-asian to notice this, or mention it, or even more importantly, ....... can we (as a school) talk about why the asians dominate our AP programs while our black and mexican kids do not seem to take these classes?

I use to monitor after school detention to make a little extra scratch. about 65% of our school is asian, but...... do you know what % of asian kids are usually in detention? (take a guess)

There were days in detention that half of the 35-40 kids I had in detention were mexican and black, and they make up like 11-13% of the school population. What does that mean? Can we talk about why? Do asian kids not get in trouble? ........ or do teachers let them "slide" more often than not. Is there a preconceived idea that asian kids are "better" more "respectable", not "trouble" kids so they get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to punishments?

Would it be wrong for the school to form a think tank to address this issue?
Would it be wrong for the school to NOT form a think tank to address this issue?

I guess my bottom line is, we have to be able to ask questions without the fear of some one pulling the race card. I can tell you that as a teacher, it is a BIG concern and worry among my peers.

So back to the original question......

What is Nick Fury's race? I have no idea, I don't' read Marvel books. I know I've seen older pics of him as a old crusty white dude with an eye patch. But I have also seen him as a black dude. So.....

I have no idea, but I don't think there is any problem in asking the question given the two facts listed above.

exactly

[iwantvaliant]

He's a human.

And again:

I think that's a species and not a race.

As for the rest of the high context conversation all I can say is -ahhhh the age of oversensitivity- The modern idiot's form of manipulation.

Interesting you should say that. I would think dividing people would be a bigger form of manipulation.

People have defining characteristics, there is nothing wrong with noting those. No one would be offended if he was asking "wasn't Nick Fury bald? Now he has hair! WTH?!" But if you mention race, sexuality, etc. people make a big deal.

Now, if you start to judge people based on genetic differences (race, hair color, etc.) then you're a *SQUEE*, but you can't get around the fact that each person looks different, and some groups of people have similar characteristics. Grouping and dividing is natural. My 2 year old groups his trucks. Is he racist against firetrucks? Let's not be silly.

I just thought Euro Imperialism like a week ago in summer school (Including Social Darwinism and the Euros taking over Africa). So of course I have the platform to discuss this very topic.
What I have always said (and what I just said) is that we all make judgements on people based on appearances. I tell the kids.... you see some one at the movies or mall or Tilly's or whatever and based on just appearance you decide..... "hot or not" "cool or fool". I tell the kids they judged me when they first saw me, just like I made judgements on them.....

The issue is that if we let the preconceived judgements effect our actions..... then we might have problems.

The example I ALWAYS use is...... I have students I like better than some. I have favorites. Students have favorite teachers, I have favorite students. BUT...... when it comes to grading their work, I grade blind. I don't grade any differently. Just because an "A" student currently has a high grade does not mean that when I grade their work I glance over it, while a "C" student might get a more careful look.

The racism issue will always be there (I'd imagine, but maybe not). We have to be able to ask questions and talk about "race" issues. Every person and every group of persons (large and small) will have what is offensive to them and allowable. Just this week my wife had the TV on and a rerun of "The View" was on. I happen to look up and saw Whoppi Goldberg say something like, "that's right, it's all Black people up here". All of the host of this episode happened to be black. Is it a problem she said it? what if a white person or asian, or mexican person said it? ("that's right, it's all white people up here" "thats's right it's all mexican people up here") Is it ok? We can't be afraid to talk about these issues.

I teach at a school that is mostly asian (like 65% of the students are asian). I also teach two AP US Hist classes. out of my entire class, I might have 3 non asians in class, maybe. Is it racist for a non-asian to notice this, or mention it, or even more importantly, ....... can we (as a school) talk about why the asians dominate our AP programs while our black and mexican kids do not seem to take these classes?

I use to monitor after school detention to make a little extra scratch. about 65% of our school is asian, but...... do you know what % of asian kids are usually in detention? (take a guess)

There were days in detention that half of the 35-40 kids I had in detention were mexican and black, and they make up like 11-13% of the school population. What does that mean? Can we talk about why? Do asian kids not get in trouble? ........ or do teachers let them "slide" more often than not. Is there a preconceived idea that asian kids are "better" more "respectable", not "trouble" kids so they get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to punishments?

Would it be wrong for the school to form a think tank to address this issue?
Would it be wrong for the school to NOT form a think tank to address this issue?

I guess my bottom line is, we have to be able to ask questions without the fear of some one pulling the race card. I can tell you that as a teacher, it is a BIG concern and worry among my peers.

So back to the original question......

What is Nick Fury's race? I have no idea, I don't' read Marvel books. I know I've seen older pics of him as a old crusty white dude with an eye patch. But I have also seen him as a black dude. So.....

I have no idea, but I don't think there is any problem in asking the question given the two facts listed above.

Elveen, thank you very much for this well reasoned dissertation. You answered my original question (does it matter?) in a detailed and passionate way that didn't resort to name calling. I accept your answer.

To be clear, I never called anybody a racist, nor did I ever think that. Also, I am not a victim of 'liberal guilt.'

I struggle to put into words where I come from on this. I'm not as articulate as I like to be. From my limited reading of the Marvel Universe, Nick Fury's race doesn't seem to be a part of his identity like it is for Storm or Black Panther, or even Quantum. Nick Fury is a gruff, half blind guy, and I'm able to identify him immediately without it taking me out of the story.

But on the other hand I am put off by the female Loki. Probably because I think it's stupid. But that of course doesn't mean that I think women are stupid.

So, apologies that I derailed this thread. And again, Elveen, thank you for your perspective.

(We all know that Nick Fury looks like David Hasselhoff anyway.)

[Elveen]

Ha!
Don't hassle the Hoff!

[slym2none]

I heard Nick was more into the hurdles, both 50M and 100M - but not straight foot-races.



-slym

[depluto]

[Bone-A-Fach-ee]

Soooo, that actually happened, huh? "Hey David, you're going to be naked with pug puppies. Noooo, it won't look weird at all, trust me!"

[slym2none]

-slym

[lorddunlow]

Well, VF.com was nice while it lasted. I'll never be visiting again. It's like Slym posted for me with that gif, My Little Pony and all!

[xodacia81]

He's a human.

And again:

I think that's a species and not a race.

As for the rest of the high context conversation all I can say is -ahhhh the age of oversensitivity- The modern idiot's form of manipulation.

Interesting you should say that. I would think dividing people would be a bigger form of manipulation.

People have defining characteristics, there is nothing wrong with noting those. No one would be offended if he was asking "wasn't Nick Fury bald? Now he has hair! WTH?!" But if you mention race, sexuality, etc. people make a big deal.

Now, if you start to judge people based on genetic differences (race, hair color, etc.) then you're a *SQUEE*, but you can't get around the fact that each person looks different, and some groups of people have similar characteristics. Grouping and dividing is natural. My 2 year old groups his trucks. Is he racist against firetrucks? Let's not be silly.

I just thought Euro Imperialism like a week ago in summer school (Including Social Darwinism and the Euros taking over Africa). So of course I have the platform to discuss this very topic.
What I have always said (and what I just said) is that we all make judgements on people based on appearances. I tell the kids.... you see some one at the movies or mall or Tilly's or whatever and based on just appearance you decide..... "hot or not" "cool or fool". I tell the kids they judged me when they first saw me, just like I made judgements on them.....

The issue is that if we let the preconceived judgements effect our actions..... then we might have problems.

The example I ALWAYS use is...... I have students I like better than some. I have favorites. Students have favorite teachers, I have favorite students. BUT...... when it comes to grading their work, I grade blind. I don't grade any differently. Just because an "A" student currently has a high grade does not mean that when I grade their work I glance over it, while a "C" student might get a more careful look.

The racism issue will always be there (I'd imagine, but maybe not). We have to be able to ask questions and talk about "race" issues. Every person and every group of persons (large and small) will have what is offensive to them and allowable. Just this week my wife had the TV on and a rerun of "The View" was on. I happen to look up and saw Whoppi Goldberg say something like, "that's right, it's all Black people up here". All of the host of this episode happened to be black. Is it a problem she said it? what if a white person or asian, or mexican person said it? ("that's right, it's all white people up here" "thats's right it's all mexican people up here") Is it ok? We can't be afraid to talk about these issues.

I teach at a school that is mostly asian (like 65% of the students are asian). I also teach two AP US Hist classes. out of my entire class, I might have 3 non asians in class, maybe. Is it racist for a non-asian to notice this, or mention it, or even more importantly, ....... can we (as a school) talk about why the asians dominate our AP programs while our black and mexican kids do not seem to take these classes?

I use to monitor after school detention to make a little extra scratch. about 65% of our school is asian, but...... do you know what % of asian kids are usually in detention? (take a guess)

There were days in detention that half of the 35-40 kids I had in detention were mexican and black, and they make up like 11-13% of the school population. What does that mean? Can we talk about why? Do asian kids not get in trouble? ........ or do teachers let them "slide" more often than not. Is there a preconceived idea that asian kids are "better" more "respectable", not "trouble" kids so they get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to punishments?

Would it be wrong for the school to form a think tank to address this issue?
Would it be wrong for the school to NOT form a think tank to address this issue?

I guess my bottom line is, we have to be able to ask questions without the fear of some one pulling the race card. I can tell you that as a teacher, it is a BIG concern and worry among my peers.

So back to the original question......

What is Nick Fury's race? I have no idea, I don't' read Marvel books. I know I've seen older pics of him as a old crusty white dude with an eye patch. But I have also seen him as a black dude. So.....

I have no idea, but I don't think there is any problem in asking the question given the two facts listed above.

I know some anthropologists and sociologists that would say asking the question is racist, and then get *SQUEE* when you didn't ask the question. There's no pleasing some folks.

[Savant]

I struggle to put into words where I come from on this. I'm not as articulate as I like to be. From my limited reading of the Marvel Universe, Nick Fury's race doesn't seem to be a part of his identity like it is for Storm or Black Panther, or even Quantum. Nick Fury is a gruff, half blind guy, and I'm able to identify him immediately without it taking me out of the story.

How is being white not a part of the regular MU Nick Fury's identity? It's a part of who he is, just as much as Ultimate MU Nick Fury being black is a part of his identity.

But on the other hand I am put off by the female Loki. Probably because I think it's stupid. But that of course doesn't mean that I think women are stupid.

How was it stupid, and why would you be put off by it? It was Loki using another guise to misdirect certain characters.

I must ask.......Were you put off by black Heimdall? lol

[Savant]

Soooo, that actually happened, huh? "Hey David, you're going to be naked with pug puppies. Noooo, it won't look weird at all, trust me!"

I find it very intolerant of you to assume they're pug puppies. What? Because they're beige and have wrinkles, they're automatically pugs? Do all beige dogs look the same to you?

Those are sharpei puppies, good sir.

[Baramos]

For some reason this entire conversation reminds me of that Sealab 2021 exchange:

http://video.adultswim.com/sealab-2021/ ... bbies.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Marco: Well, Debbie thinks this is all about her biological clock.
Stormy: She stopped screaming enough to tell you that?
Marco: No no no no, the other Debbie. Debbie the teacher.
Stormy: Oh, you mean... black Debbie.
Sparks: Woah woah woah, why is she... black Debbie?
Stormy: Not in a bad way, it's just to tell them apart because she's... black.
Sparks: Well, why don't you call her Debbie, and call the other one... white Debbie.
Stormy: White Debbie? That's stupid! I know she's white.
Marco: Then why do you call the other Debbie "black Debbie?" You know she's black!
Stormy: Hey, first off, I really don't think we should be talking about this in front of Dr. Quinn.
Quinn: Listen man, you're missing the point. What if everybody went around calling you "white Stormy?"
Stormy: You mean there's a black Stormy?
Quinn: ... No.

[Knightt]

You white boys are crazy.

[Uncle Yusuf]

So, is he white in regular Mavel continuity, and black in the Ultimate Universe? Is that the understanding? Kinda confused..... again.... with Marvel..... what a surprise....
Anyone know the answer?
Thanks

Nick Fury is a (White? Is this offensive?) Caucasian man in the mainstream Marvel Universe as far as I know. Oh, and I don't think it's a problem that you asked.

[Uncle Yusuf]

I struggle to put into words where I come from on this. I'm not as articulate as I like to be. From my limited reading of the Marvel Universe, Nick Fury's race doesn't seem to be a part of his identity like it is for Storm or Black Panther, or even Quantum. Nick Fury is a gruff, half blind guy, and I'm able to identify him immediately without it taking me out of the story.

How is being white not a part of the regular MU Nick Fury's identity? It's a part of who he is, just as much as Ultimate MU Nick Fury being black is a part of his identity.

But on the other hand I am put off by the female Loki. Probably because I think it's stupid. But that of course doesn't mean that I think women are stupid.

How was it stupid, and why would you be put off by it? It was Loki using another guise to misdirect certain characters.

I must ask.......Were you put off by black Heimdall? lol

Idris Elba would've made an awesome Superman! I think even better than Henry Cavill! In the meantime, I'd love for Chiwetol Ejiofor ('Serenity', 'Love Actually', 'Red Belt') to play Lex Luthor in the Man of Steel sequel! Oh, man, that'd be soooo cool! He'd be the best Lex Luthor EVER. What an actor!

[lorddunlow]

I struggle to put into words where I come from on this. I'm not as articulate as I like to be. From my limited reading of the Marvel Universe, Nick Fury's race doesn't seem to be a part of his identity like it is for Storm or Black Panther, or even Quantum. Nick Fury is a gruff, half blind guy, and I'm able to identify him immediately without it taking me out of the story.

How is being white not a part of the regular MU Nick Fury's identity? It's a part of who he is, just as much as Ultimate MU Nick Fury being black is a part of his identity.

But on the other hand I am put off by the female Loki. Probably because I think it's stupid. But that of course doesn't mean that I think women are stupid.

How was it stupid, and why would you be put off by it? It was Loki using another guise to misdirect certain characters.

I must ask.......Were you put off by black Heimdall? lol

Idris Elba would've made an awesome Superman! I think even better than Henry Cavill! In the meantime, I'd love for Chiwetol Ejiofor ('Serenity', 'Love Actually', 'Red Belt') to play Lex Luthor in the Man of Steel sequel! Oh, man, that'd be soooo cool! He'd be the best Lex Luthor EVER.

No kidding. That dude is bad-*SQUEE*! He'd make an excellent Lex Luthor.

[Knightt]

Race problems... who's the racist any more, who's not and when haven't we had race problems ? I've seen more black people in the media being racist than I have in years. Just the other night watching TV, scene between Chris Rock and Maya Rudolph where they are dancing to the song "Sentimental Lady" and Maya describes the song as the "whitest song ever".

If a white person were to make a similar comment except the other way around... well, there would be those who take offense.

Zimmerman kills Martin and it gets national attention, hell even Stevie Wonder said that he would no longer perform in Florida or any other state that had the "Stand Your Ground Law". Black people kill black people every day, white people kill white people every day but it took something like Zimmerman killing Martin to get such a reaction. Why wasn't Stevie Wonder refusing to perform in Florida since the year 2005 when the law was established ? I don't know.

While not a professional way to conduct business, a white doctor told a black woman why she was having severe lower back problems. Instead of relaying his diagnosis in professional terms, he told her that she had "ghetto booty" and she got all bent.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/lifest ... 6680696488" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've been around the block to know that if a black doctor told this same black woman she had "ghetto booty", it would have gone over with a big laugh, so why was this recent incident such an issue ? I don't know.

At work, we are lucky to have a good crew... black, white, latino, oriental, former officer, former enlisted, civilian, Christan, Muslim, atheist, everybody is fair game with jokes. That is what you get when you grow up in the Army where everyone's color is camouflage. Yet we still make jokes like "I notice you minorities do this" and "I notice you white people do that". Maybe that doesn't make it right either but I think we are smart enough to identify an issue and if it were to become a 'real problem' for us, we take care of it accordingly, apologize when needed, and call bullS#!t when appropriate. Why does this work out so well for us ? Why has there never been a problem in the past four years I've worked there ? I don't know.

My kids come home from school occasionally telling me how some racial remark was made, sometimes against them (we are white folks), and nothing done about it. If someone were to put the shoe on the other foot and say some equally racial remark... boom, down comes the hammer, parents are called in and the $#!Tstorm begins. My kids have genuinely asked me why this is, and I can only say... I don't know.

Back to the issue at hand though... Nick Fury started out as a white guy in the Marvel Universe. Later when the Ultimate Marvel line came out, he was a black guy. Other things were changed in that universe as well, perhaps to modernize it. I enjoy both universes, both have their ups and downs. I think the Ultimate Marvel Universe Nick Fury was so popular that he stuck as the Marvel Movie Universe movies. Besides, Samuel Jackson is a good actor.

I just read the Garth Ennis mini-series, "Fury: My War Gone By" in the MAX Comics line by Marvel. Damn, probably the best mini-series I've read in a long time. I like both versions of Fury and I know why.

Good storytelling is storytelling.

[Burrito Boy]

Soooo, that actually happened, huh? "Hey David, you're going to be naked with pug puppies. Noooo, it won't look weird at all, trust me!"

I find it very intolerant of you to assume they're pug puppies. What? Because they're beige and have wrinkles, they're automatically pugs? Do all beige dogs look the same to you?

Those are sharpei puppies, good sir.

[Cyberstrike]

And again:

I think that's a species and not a race.

As for the rest of the high context conversation all I can say is -ahhhh the age of oversensitivity- The modern idiot's form of manipulation.

Interesting you should say that. I would think dividing people would be a bigger form of manipulation.

People have defining characteristics, there is nothing wrong with noting those. No one would be offended if he was asking "wasn't Nick Fury bald? Now he has hair! WTH?!" But if you mention race, sexuality, etc. people make a big deal.

Now, if you start to judge people based on genetic differences (race, hair color, etc.) then you're a *SQUEE*, but you can't get around the fact that each person looks different, and some groups of people have similar characteristics. Grouping and dividing is natural. My 2 year old groups his trucks. Is he racist against *SQUEE*? Let's not be silly.

I just thought Euro Imperialism like a week ago in summer school (Including Social Darwinism and the Euros taking over Africa). So of course I have the platform to discuss this very topic.
What I have always said (and what I just said) is that we all make judgements on people based on appearances. I tell the kids.... you see some one at the movies or mall or Tilly's or whatever and based on just appearance you decide..... "hot or not" "cool or fool". I tell the kids they judged me when they first saw me, just like I made judgements on them.....

The issue is that if we let the preconceived judgements effect our actions..... then we might have problems.

The example I ALWAYS use is...... I have students I like better than some. I have favorites. Students have favorite teachers, I have favorite students. BUT...... when it comes to grading their work, I grade blind. I don't grade any differently. Just because an "A" student currently has a high grade does not mean that when I grade their work I glance over it, while a "C" student might get a more careful look.

The racism issue will always be there (I'd imagine, but maybe not). We have to be able to ask questions and talk about "race" issues. Every person and every group of persons (large and small) will have what is offensive to them and allowable. Just this week my wife had the TV on and a rerun of "The View" was on. I happen to look up and saw Whoppi Goldberg say something like, "that's right, it's all Black people up here". All of the host of this episode happened to be black. Is it a problem she said it? what if a white person or asian, or mexican person said it? ("that's right, it's all white people up here" "thats's right it's all mexican people up here") Is it ok? We can't be afraid to talk about these issues.

I teach at a school that is mostly asian (like 65% of the students are asian). I also teach two AP US Hist classes. out of my entire class, I might have 3 non asians in class, maybe. Is it racist for a non-asian to notice this, or mention it, or even more importantly, ....... can we (as a school) talk about why the asians dominate our AP programs while our black and mexican kids do not seem to take these classes?

I use to monitor after school detention to make a little extra scratch. about 65% of our school is asian, but...... do you know what % of asian kids are usually in detention? (take a guess)

There were days in detention that half of the 35-40 kids I had in detention were mexican and black, and they make up like 11-13% of the school population. What does that mean? Can we talk about why? Do asian kids not get in trouble? ........ or do teachers let them "slide" more often than not. Is there a preconceived idea that asian kids are "better" more "respectable", not "trouble" kids so they get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to punishments?

Would it be wrong for the school to form a think tank to address this issue?
Would it be wrong for the school to NOT form a think tank to address this issue?

I guess my bottom line is, we have to be able to ask questions without the fear of some one pulling the race card. I can tell you that as a teacher, it is a BIG concern and worry among my peers.

So back to the original question......

What is Nick Fury's race? I have no idea, I don't' read Marvel books. I know I've seen older pics of him as a old crusty white dude with an eye patch. But I have also seen him as a black dude. So.....

I have no idea, but I don't think there is any problem in asking the question given the two facts listed above.

Elveen, thank you very much for this well reasoned dissertation. You answered my original question (does it matter?) in a detailed and passionate way that didn't resort to name calling. I accept your answer.

To be clear, I never called anybody a racist, nor did I ever think that. Also, I am not a victim of 'liberal guilt.'

I struggle to put into words where I come from on this. I'm not as articulate as I like to be. From my limited reading of the Marvel Universe, Nick Fury's race doesn't seem to be a part of his identity like it is for Storm or Black Panther, or even Quantum. Nick Fury is a gruff, half blind guy, and I'm able to identify him immediately without it taking me out of the story.

But on the other hand I am put off by the female Loki. Probably because I think it's stupid. But that of course doesn't mean that I think women are stupid.

So, apologies that I derailed this thread. And again, Elveen, thank you for your perspective.

(We all know that Nick Fury looks like David Hasselhoff anyway.)

I'm liberal and I don't suffer from "liberal guilt" I'm just try to respect people. Big difference.

[OmenSpirits.com]

Mark Miller's Ultimates definitely predates Samuel Jackson's portrayal of Nick Fury. I forgot which recent Avengers title I read, *gosh there's so many new ones with the Marvel Now* there was a scene where Hawkeye made a funny quip about it. Given how popular Samuel Jackson is associated with the character now, I think Marvel is officially making him black from this point on.

Sam jackson was the visual template the artist drawing the ultimates used.

Nick fury originally was white.

In the Ultimates universe he became black, much like the Ultimates Spider-man is a minority.

NF has been around for decades.

[Knightt]

But the original Ultimate Spider-Man was white.

[OmenSpirits.com]

And I think he died.