How to CGC pre-screen?

Neurosis1 · Post by **Neurosis1** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 4:25 pm

I don't see the instructions for doing a pre-screen through CGC on their site. Does anyone know how to order this service.

-Chris

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 4:31 pm

Call them. They usually frown upon doing it with small numbers of books, or will charge you more for the pre-screen fee on the ones they kick.

Escaflown4 · Post by **Escaflown4** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:34 pm

Yeah I've been looking into it as well. It seems from their response on the forums that you need a minimum of 50 books per tier to prescreen. On the order form, just write down what the minimum grade you want to slab. They slab all those books that meets the grade level and charge you a small fee for each book that don't make the grade. If I read it correctly, it's like $3-4 per each book that gets ungraded. Still a pretty hefty price tag for the grand total if you ask me.

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:08 pm

Something that I did not know about pre-screen was that the books dont all have to be the same. I thought that pre-screen was for 50 copies of rai 0 or all of the modern subs that people send in. I have no idea that you could send in magnus 0-50 for prescreen...I always wondered who had that many copies of one book.

justin · Post by **justin** » Thu Dec 09, 2004 2:09 pm

DawgPhan wrote:Something that I did not know about pre-screen was that the books dont all have to be the same. I thought that pre-screen was for 50 copies of rai 0 or all of the modern subs that people send in. I have no idea that you could send in magnus 0-50 for prescreen...I always wondered who had that many copies of one book.

Hell I would love to get my hands on 20 copies of Unity Red or Harbinger 0 pink!

-A

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Thu Dec 09, 2004 9:48 pm

Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:05 am

Cause you'll get back a bunch of 8.5s and 9.0s and worse you don't want.

Unless you are perfect. Like ZWH.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?

x-omatic · Post by **x-omatic** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:05 am

ckb wrote:Cause you'll get back a bunch of 8.5s and 9.0s and worse you don't want.

Unless you are perfect. Like ZWH.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?

I pre-screened the ones I sent and got back all 9.6 and 9.8 books.

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:09 am

Like ZWH and x-omatic.

Seriously, I'm glad you guys are apparently able to do this so easily. It just isn't like that for some of us less-than-perfect folk. I sent in about 240 books and they kicked about 30% of them. Even if I cut that error rate in half, it's still 35 books, and 35 full grading fees, I don't want to pay for.

Joey/Comickings: Do you wish you had pre-screened some of your Valiant submissions?

x-omatic wrote:
ckb wrote:Cause you'll get back a bunch of 8.5s and 9.0s and worse you don't want.

Unless you are perfect. Like ZWH.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?
I pre-screened the ones I sent and got back all 9.6 and 9.8 books.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:46 am

x-omatic wrote:
ckb wrote:Cause you'll get back a bunch of 8.5s and 9.0s and worse you don't want.

Unless you are perfect. Like ZWH.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?
I pre-screened the ones I sent and got back all 9.6 and 9.8 books.

<laughs>...I was JUST about to type this when I read CKB's response.

Knowing how to grade, of course, is the underlying assumption one must make if one is to screen their own books.

There's no way, unless I had a frontal lobotomy, that I would send in books expecting 9.6 and get 8.5. Not going to happen, outside of freak instances <includes lame qualification for people who need that sort of thing>.

That's like saying Greg doesn't know how to do some sort of basic computer thingie, or Dino doesn't know how to spend money, or Knightt doesn't know how to boom boom.

It's not bragging..it's just what we DO. The odds of making a mistake like that are incredibly low, because that's what happens when you dedicate a good portion of your time and effort to one activity.

depluto · Post by **depluto** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 11:17 am

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:That's like saying Greg doesn't know how to do some sort of basic computer thingie, or Dino doesn't know how to spend money, or Knightt doesn't know how to boom boom.

I had to absorb that for a second, then laughed my *SQUEE* off.

For the record, I have only a basic idea how to grade. If I were going to send in a bunch of comics to CGC I would probably pre-screen. Then again, I think there are good unslabbed comics for sale, so I must be a CGC hater.

mrwoogieman · Post by **mrwoogieman** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 11:26 am

I can grade and I don't pre-screen moderns because I'm looking for 9.6 and 9.8. So it's pretty simple really, see any flaws, yes put it to the side, no on the submission pile, next book, repeat...

Now, if I had a big batch of pre 1975 books that I was looking for anything over 9.0 or 9.2, I would probably pre-screen, because the full cost for even a few that fall below 9.0 would more than offset the cost of the pre-screen. I can't say for certain that my 9.0 wouldn't be CGCs 8.0 or 8.5. Therefore, pre-screens would serve a purpose for me in this scenario. PLEASE LET ME HAVE NEED FOR PRE-SCREENING SOON!!

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:24 pm

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote: It's not bragging..it's just what we DO. The odds of making a mistake like that are incredibly low, because that's what happens when you dedicate a good portion of your time and effort to one activity.

More power to you. But I do not think you should be telling others that there is no need to pre-screen. It's simply not true for 98+% of us.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:52 pm

ckb wrote:Like ZWH and x-omatic.

Seriously, I'm glad you guys are apparently able to do this so easily. It just isn't like that for some of us less-than-perfect folk. I sent in about 240 books and they kicked about 30% of them. Even if I cut that error rate in half, it's still 35 books, and 35 full grading fees, I don't want to pay for.

Joey/Comickings: Do you wish you had pre-screened some of your Valiant submissions?

x-omatic wrote:
ckb wrote:Cause you'll get back a bunch of 8.5s and 9.0s and worse you don't want.

Unless you are perfect. Like ZWH.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Why not just pre-screen them yourself and save the cost?
I pre-screened the ones I sent and got back all 9.6 and 9.8 books.

My question was not meant to disparage those who DO pre-screen. It's something that is obviously needed by a great deal of the people who do submit, and there's nothing wrong with that.

I don't change the oil in my car, because there are people FARRRR more qualified than I to do that. I CAN do it, but it'd take me about two hours, make a big mess, and I'd have to get rid of the oil. So, I have the pros do it. And there's nothing wrong with that.

BUT....if I ever were to get very proficient at changing my oil, or did it for financial gain, I'd likely do it myself.

Same with pre-screening...if you don't have the time or desire to learn, it's a valuable service, if the benefits outweight the costs.

But it's not difficult to learn how to grade properly, and that cost can EASILY be saved if one were to take the time and gain the knowledge to do it.

Ask X-O. I was looking at his books, and pointing out flaws even HE didn't see, because I have trained my eye to that extent for such a long time. But it's not rocket science, and anyone with an IQ above 90 should be able to manage just fine.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:53 pm

ckb wrote:
ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote: It's not bragging..it's just what we DO. The odds of making a mistake like that are incredibly low, because that's what happens when you dedicate a good portion of your time and effort to one activity.
More power to you. But I do not think you should be telling others that there is no need to pre-screen. It's simply not true for 98+% of us.

There's not a need for a pre-screen....if one wishes to take the time to learn. If they don't have or can't make the time, then there's a need for pre-screen, as I just stated. That's just basic common sense. Why pay someone $3 PER BOOK to do what YOU can do yourself?

And for the record, I didn't tell anyone there was 'no need to pre-screen' (well, before just now.

) I asked why not do it yourself. Big difference. But regardless, even if I had, who is anyone to say to anyone else what they can and cannot tell others on a chatboard? If you disagree, state that, but don't sit there and say 'I don't think you should be telling people this or that.' You are free to say anything you'd like, within Greg's rules, as is everyone else, including me. I don't run around telling others what they should and should not be telling people. I expect the same courtesy in return.

I don't even pretend to know a fraction of what, say, Greg knows about computer science, but it's not as if you or I couldn't learn with time, education, and practice. That's my point. GRADING...ISN'T...HARD. No one said I was 'perfect', so the sarcasm is really unnecessary.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:58 pm

And if I'm ever looking at anyone's books for some reason, I'll pre-screen them FOR FREE. How's that for putting your money where your mouth is?

whetteon · Post by **whetteon** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:07 pm

Let's say that 10 solar #1's show up at your house, would you prescreen the 9.6 and higher for cgc and send the rejects back to me?

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:24 pm

I think you are being a tad obtuse, here, Zeph. All my statements were presented as opinion, "I think you should", etc.

I disagree with your statements that pre-screen is unnecessary, even for someone practiced. You are bound to make mistakes on a large number of books, and the current minimum is 50. It used to be 100. I find it hard to imagine that anyone could send in 100 pre-1994 books and get NM+ and higher on all.

Now, if you send in 5, you have a good shot. But, we're talking about pre-screen, and the minumum is, at least publically, 50 books. This is where my sarcasm is from. Missing small interior tears, faint cover impressions, not accounting for the significance of a bindery defect, etc ... are not issues with your grading skill. It's an issue of being human.

You only pay the $3-$4 fee on the ones that are not slabbed. Otherwise it's free. So, for the mythical perfect grader, who can do no wrong, pre-screen is still the right way to go - it's free. Your book could have been damaged in shipping or by mishandling from the grader.

So, I see your insistance that you are correct as more of an inexperience with CGC, and I'm trying to educate, not berate. My sarcasm was to make a point, which I have just spelled out in detail.

Feel free to continue to tell board members whatever you like, but try to be responsible about it.

Grading is hard for most people. Some people are just good at it.

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:
ckb wrote:
ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote: It's not bragging..it's just what we DO. The odds of making a mistake like that are incredibly low, because that's what happens when you dedicate a good portion of your time and effort to one activity.
More power to you. But I do not think you should be telling others that there is no need to pre-screen. It's simply not true for 98+% of us.
There's not a need for a pre-screen....if one wishes to take the time to learn. If they don't have or can't make the time, then there's a need for pre-screen, as I just stated. That's just basic common sense. Why pay someone $3 PER BOOK to do what YOU can do yourself?

And for the record, I didn't tell anyone there was 'no need to pre-screen'. I asked why not do it yourself. Big difference. But regardless, even if I had, who is anyone to say to anyone else what they can and cannot tell others on a chatboard? If you disagree, state that, but don't sit there and say 'I don't think you should be telling people this or that.' You are free to say anything you'd like, within Greg's rules, as is everyone else, including me. I don't run around telling others what they should and should not be telling people. I expect the same courtesy in return.

I don't even pretend to know a fraction of what, say, Greg knows about computer science, but it's not as if you or I couldn't learn with time, education, and practice. That's my point. GRADING...ISN'T...HARD. No one said I was 'perfect', so the sarcasm is really unnecessary.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:06 pm

whetteon wrote:Let's say that 10 solar #1's show up at your house, would you prescreen the 9.6 and higher for cgc and send the rejects back to me?

Sure.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:38 pm

ckb wrote:I think you are being a tad obtuse, here, Zeph. All my statements were presented as opinion, "I think you should", etc.

And I think you're being a tad confrontational. Wait, scratch 'tad'. "I think you should NOT be telling others what to do" is a whole lot different from "I think you should do such and such". So that horse don't play.

I disagree with your statements that pre-screen is unnecessary, even for someone practiced. You are bound to make mistakes on a large number of books, and the current minimum is 50. It used to be 100. I find it hard to imagine that anyone could send in 100 pre-1994 books and get NM+ and higher on all.

That's because you just don't know how to grade that well. If you focus on what you're doing, paying close attention, the 'bound to make mistakes' in terms of the laws of probability is VASTLY mitigated. Bank of America has a GREAT commercial about this...they process ELEVEN MILLION checks a day. They are BOUND to make mistakes, right? Of course, but those mistakes are HIGHLY mitigated because of their philosophy of 'doing ONE right...and then repeating it 11 million times.'

It's a whole different mindset. You don't sit there and pre-screen 100, or even 50, books in one sitting. You sit there and do them one by one by one, and if you get tired....you step away and DO something else...and come back when you're refreshed.

That's how major mistakes are mitigated (the reverse of that is also how major mistakes are MADE, by the way.)

The CGC pre-screen was unnecessary for X-O because he *knows what he's doing.* The pre-screen is unnecessary for me, because *I know what I'm doing.* I daresay the pre-screen is unnecessary for Peter Parker, or any of a number of super anal, super high grade, or super high dollar book collectors.

Now, if you send in 5, you have a good shot. But, we're talking about pre-screen, and the minumum is, at least publically, 50 books. This is where my sarcasm is from. Missing small interior tears, faint cover impressions, not accounting for the significance of a bindery defect, etc ... are not issues with your grading skill. It's an issue of being human.

Again, just because you and a vast sea of eBay sellers can't/don't know how to grade properly, doesn't mean that everyone does not as well, and it certainly doesn't mean you should drag the entire human race down to your inexperienced level.

You don't understand that there are ways and methods to mitigate the 'being human means making mistakes' part. One of them is the one I explained up there. Another is developing such a critical eye that you might even OVER-do it, ie, calling a legit 9.8 book a 9.6. But, of course, that works in your favor, so no harm, no foul.

No one said it wasn't work. It's a LOT of work. It's just not incredibly DIFFICULT work. Like digging post holes. It sucks, and it's hard, and it takes a long time...but it's not terribly mind bending.

You only pay the $3-$4 fee on the ones that are not slabbed. Otherwise it's free. So, for the mythical perfect grader, who can do no wrong, pre-screen is still the right way to go - it's free. Your book could have been damaged in shipping or by mishandling from the grader.

Such sarcasm, CKB. So unnecessary in a discussion. ONCE AGAIN...YOU are the ONLY ONE who has said the word 'perfect' as it relates to being able to grade. Just you. No one else has said anything about being a 'perfect grade', mythical or not.

It's about being critical enough to SPOT flaws and then ANALYZE what the totality of flaws a book has does to the overall grade. A book has 3-4 non color breaking stress marks, 1/16" or less and that's it? A 9.6. Book has a subtle bit of scuff at the top and bottom of the spine, no more than 1/32" and that's it? 9.8 Book has ZERO visible flaws, INSIDE and out? 10.0

Not rocket science.

BUT...if it's FREE if the books pass muster (FREE being the operative word, here), then hey, pre-screen AND let CGC pre-screen....and if you're a good enough grader, you lose nothing. There's nothing wrong with that.

And 'damaged from shipping or mishandling by the grader' has ZERO relevance to this discussion. Those are very rare, very freak incidents that have NOTHING TO DO with a person's ability, or lack thereof, to pre-screen. That a pre-screen would CATCH something like that still doesn't justify its cost. That's what insurance is for, and it's a whole lot less than $3 a book (on the assumption that pre-screening is NOT for high dollar [over $100] books.)

So, I see your insistance that you are correct as more of an inexperience with CGC, and I'm trying to educate, not berate. My sarcasm was to make a point, which I have just spelled out in detail.

Since you are unable to have a discussion without nonsensical insults and retorts, CKB, I'll refrain from responding to you further. I don't wish to get involved in a *SQUEE* match. Well, ok, I *DO*...but it's dull, and angers the board owner.

Suffice it to say, your attempt to spin this into a 'ZWH always thinks he's right' situation just reveals your general lack of maturity and inability to discuss serious topics without resorting to potshots. This wasn't a 'I'm right, you're wrong' discussion until you just typed that sentence up there.

<shrug>

Feel free to continue to tell board members whatever you like, but try to be responsible about it.

Hey, look, CKB...just because you can't grade, need to pay someone else to do it for you, and get hostile when people call you on it, doesn't mean that what they're saying is irresponsible. I'm sorry you don't know how to grade, but I would be MORE than willing to demonstrate and give you lessons if we're at a con together. I'll even give you a board member discount, how's that?

Grading is hard for most people. Some people are just good at it.

Grading is hard for people who don't want to learn. Grading is about as difficult as learning your multiplication tables. It doesn't require a lot of brain power, just a lot of practice. People who want to learn find it's easy and they can do it well, in a rather short period of time.

I'm terribly sorry that it's hard for *you*, but again, I'm more than happy to tutor you, if you'd like. But, please...do stop making excuses for your inability to grade, and trying to bring everyone else down to YOUR inexperienced level. That's as insulting as the Barbie that used to say 'Math is hard!'

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:41 pm

ckb wrote: I find it hard to imagine that anyone could send in 100 pre-1994 books and get NM+ and higher on all.

Oh, one small line I missed. NO ONE said anything about 'pre-1994' books.

Who, besides you, said ANYTHING about 'pre-1994' books?

This was only about PRE-SCREENING, whether the book was printed in 1852 or 2004. Do stop attempting to change the rules halfway through the game.

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 8:34 pm

This kind of know-it-all attitude is dangerous, ZWH. It does not suit you. And I am not trying to be confrontational. I am trying to add a different viewpoint to "pre-screen is not necessary - do it yourself" which I find a somewhat irresponsible statement.

I do not know how to grade exactly like CGC. You do not know to grade exactly like CGC. No one knows how to grade exactly like CGC because their standard is unpublished. Only they know...

And you can berate my grading all you want, it does not bother me. I do not hold up my grading prowess as a crowning achievement. I'm just wise enough to know that mistakes happen, and the pre-screen is free. When the pre-screen is not free, it saves me $12 over the worthless slab I would get back otherwise. So it should be used whenever possible. There is no way to refute that. My mythical example was just that, mythical. But pre-screen is smart even in grading utopia.

Even if we did know their standard, mistakes will be made over large numbers of books. You seem to be denying this. That you could take your time and grade 100 books and have a 100% hit rate. I'm sure your hit rate would be plenty high. But even if you miss one, pre-screen saves you $12.

I use my real world experience when talking about pre-screen, and I have that experience with books from 1991-1994. I am not trying to change any rules - it really doesn't matter. I'm just clarifying where my limited experience lies.

No need to get weird about it, anyone can come and see both sides now, which is all good.

x-omatic · Post by **x-omatic** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:28 pm

As Zeph pointed out I missed things as well. But this was on older books that he pointed out a few color touches. I don't have experience in spotting them so did not notice them.

When I graded the books I sent I did not do them all in one day. What i did was take for example my 18 Magnus 0 books and pull out the best ones. I then looked at them closer and removed a few more. I had about 6 I would grade 9.6 or 9.8. I set them aside and waited a week. I then looked at them again to see if I would come to the same grade. Which I did. I then send just 2 of them and both got a 9.8. Now on 2 of the the other books I felt I might get a 9.9 or a 10.00 but only got a 9.6 and a 9.8. The Magnus 3 seems harder for me to grade as with a black cover it shows everything. I thought some white on the corener from binding would be ok but I guess CGC saw it as wear.

400yrs · Post by **400yrs** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:40 pm

Some people do know hos to grade. In fact, some people are better and more consistent graders than CGC.

I hope you had someone else take a look at those harby and magnus 0s before you paid over 1000 for them since you seem to think that CGC is the only place for grading.

400yrs · Post by **400yrs** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:42 pm

x-omatic wrote:
Now on 2 of the the other books I felt I might get a 9.9 or a 10.00 but only got a 9.6 and a 9.8.

Don't count on getting 9.9s or 10s from CGC unless either of the following apply:

- You are a consistent customer/dealer who submits lots and I mean LOTS of books and CGC is due to "Throw you a bone"

- You are buddies with some of the graders.