Why did Valiant sanatize it's later titles?

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Todd Luck
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Why did Valiant sanatize it's later titles?

Post by Todd Luck »

Early Valiants were probably some of the most violent mainstream comics at the time. They didn't flinch at protraying violence realisticly. Blood, gore, ect was displayed on panel. But at some point it changed. The later titles had a lot less blood, almost no gore, and death and injury wasn't so terrible. The change seems to start in the titles dated somewhere around mid to late 1993.

For instance, Shadowman 13 dealt with a serial killer and it had realistic amount of blood in it. You cut people they're bound to bleed...alot. Very few issues of the series had much blood or graphic violence after that, and I dare say none to that level. My question is why? Was this a conscious editorial desicion or just a side effect of a different creative direction? Does anyone know?

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Post by Unblessed »

no idea but I just read EW I forget the number, but the one where Gil is armless and had the warning on the cover... Yeah, useless warning. I was thinking about what you posted when I read it this morning.

*edit*

Point of contention: He stabs his daughter through her heart... no blood coming out where he went into her (right above her heart). Utter sanitization.

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Post by Kino »

The only reason I can think of why they did that was at the time, Valiant went from a small unheard of publisher with more of a narrower audience to trying to make a book for the masses. I think they just did that to broaden the appeal to a larger and dare I say, younger audience. i could be wrong but thats what I think off the top of my head.

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Post by mrwoogieman »

The cover to Shadowman 1 really set the tone for the book.
:hm:

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Post by Vault-Keeper »

The following is speculation on my part, but it is based on a factual occurance. During the mid 90's, complaint's were made to Wal-Mart's & 7-11's from Christian groups about the excess sex & violence in the magazines & comics they carried. In order to avoid a loss of circulation, many comic titles were toned down, & some were dropped completely, like the newstand version of the EC reprints.

To expand their circulation, Valiant was trying to establish newstand distribution around this same time. They might have toned down the sex & violence in order to fit PG guidelines for broader distributon. If VanHook reads this, I think he'd know for sure.---Steve

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Post by Vault-Keeper »

mrwoogieman wrote:The cover to Shadowman 1 really set the tone for the book.
I always liked the bloody, dead dinosaur head on the cover of Magnus #12! That and the creepy baby cover to Solar #9!---Steve

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Post by myron »

What about where Shakespear kills Big Boy in Hardcorps 2???...that was one of the most violent comic frames I had ever seen...
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Post by wrunow »

In my opinion, as VALIANT progressed they hired more and more of the established artists in the industry, Sears, Breyfogle, Moretti, etc. and they brought there styles that were mainly formed at Marvel or DC, and drew the Valiant characters as such.

Also, I think the change when BWS was no longer the art director had some major impact here, probably the most as he is/was a stickler for fine detailed art.
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Post by Sean_Jackson »

Yeah I was thinking about that myself recently. They were mega bloody, severed limbs, blown out brains... I had forgotten how violent they were.

Still love 'em.

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Post by Shakespeare »

myron wrote:What about where Shakespear kills Big Boy in Hardcorps 2???...that was one of the most violent comic frames I had ever seen...
I'm still trying to get the brains out of that jacket.

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Post by Todd Luck »

Shakespeare wrote:
myron wrote:What about where Shakespear kills Big Boy in Hardcorps 2???...that was one of the most violent comic frames I had ever seen...
I'm still trying to get the brains out of that jacket.
:lol:

Anyway, the trying to reach a wider audience does sounds like a plausible explaination. Curiously I read something like that about Superman and Batman back when they were first introduced. The higher their sales were, the better their behavior got.

I remember reading that Valiant lost a deal were Toys R Us would carry their comic in some form because one panel in Rai 0 went too low down Bloodshot's back for them. Blew the whole deal.

The 90's was a very strange time. You'ld have characters that do nothing but kill, but when it came to showing the violence it was strangely restrained. I remember thumbing through a Mortal Kombat comic and shaking my head at the lack of any gorey death moves done on panel. Lame.

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Post by motorhead »

You want violent comics from the 90's? Check out North Star Press. That was about as violent as you could get. Between Faust and Boots Of The Oppressor, I don't think you can get much worse. The cruel facts are that gory and Violent comics , or the companies that publish them don't last. Look at the whole list of companies out there that have came and gone; North Star, NOW, Fantagraphics, Innovation, even Dark Horse Had to change to survive, which sucks. Look at what the company was, and look at it now.
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Post by ZephyrWasHOT!! »

You know what's REALLY funny? Until people bring it up, I never ever think "violent" when I think of Pre-Unity. It's just natural, you don't even think about it.

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Post by motorhead »

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:You know what's REALLY funny? Until people bring it up, I never ever think "violent" when I think of Pre-Unity. It's just natural, you don't even think about it.
So true on that one.
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Post by Unblessed »

motorhead wrote:
ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:You know what's REALLY funny? Until people bring it up, I never ever think "violent" when I think of Pre-Unity. It's just natural, you don't even think about it.
So true on that one.
Yup, but they were more realistic than later stuff.

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Post by motorhead »

Unblessed wrote:
motorhead wrote:
ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:You know what's REALLY funny? Until people bring it up, I never ever think "violent" when I think of Pre-Unity. It's just natural, you don't even think about it.
So true on that one.
Yup, but they were more realistic than later stuff.

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Yup, and much better quality as well! :thumb:
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Post by Todd Luck »

Unblessed wrote:no idea but I just read EW I forget the number, but the one where Gil is armless and had the warning on the cover... Yeah, useless warning. I was thinking about what you posted when I read it this morning.

*edit*

Point of contention: He stabs his daughter through her heart... no blood coming out where he went into her (right above her heart). Utter sanitization.

~Unblessed
I just posted that issue on the Re-reading forum. I just realized it actually goes along with what I posted on this thread about high sales equaling nicer comics. The sales had dropped through the floor and what's the first thing that happens? Gilad gets an arm lobbed off :) . If sells kept dropping they might have had to kill most of their characters...hey, wait a minute :|. :D

Btw, is that storyline any good? I don't have any issues of it. The Immortal Enemy story before it really blew but I know Orstrander gets better on the title.

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Post by Unblessed »

Todd Luck wrote:
Btw, is that storyline any good? I don't have any issues of it. The Immortal Enemy story before it really blew but I know Orstrander gets better on the title.
The premise: Gilad has kids with women through out the ages. When the kids grow up, they all get a blood lust to kill their parents.

I think the premise is interesting.

The story opens with him fighting one of his offspring at the turn of the 20th centrury in London. He puts her down. Other than that, the story is quite bland. they reduced Gilad to Aric the barbarian. It read like an XO issue to me for some reason.

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Post by inmyblood »

The subject matter of Archer&Armstrong #0 is way over the edge.
Child molestation/rape by a pastor and his wife. I couldn't believe what I was reading when I first read that ish. :o

I would have to say that A&A is my favorite run from Valiant, minus issue #0.


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